Author Topic: Factory turbo improvement-suggestions (Read 19118 times)

snaponbob · « **Reply #25 on:** January 29, 2011, 10:30:44 PM »

WAY too much potential material there, and mostly off color !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I will say that I did not say Cialis as that apparently requires two claw-foot bath tubs, but I have no idea why.

1LILNDN · « **Reply #26 on:** January 29, 2011, 11:12:54 PM »

Could be that it is a known Fact that Lots of Animals ! Have a Hard time getting out of slippery or Inclined Areas.

WOW did this Topic get Hi-Jacked Opened a whole New

Kelu · « **Reply #27 on:** January 30, 2011, 03:28:08 AM »

Quote from: Dave@DDMworks on January 29, 2011, 09:07:24 PM

Thought I would update this thread, we have been running the BNR stage 3 here for about 2 months now and here the latest dyno run from it:

That is on 93 octane, no meth/water, intercooler, high flow cat, exhaust and an intake. Most likely with an off the shelf tune most are going to be int he 355-360whp range SAE. I will update more next week!

Dave thank you for clear data and for doing this for Kappa.

BNR stage 3 is something confusing even for me being familiar with BNR products, basically as far as I know BNR has only two stages:
- Stage 1 when the turbo housing (compressor & turbine) is kept stock, only compressor is changed with compressor from GT2860 and maybe some inside porting
- Stage 2 when only stock turbine housing is kept and everything else is from GT2871

What BNR Stage 3 is?

I know he started with the idea to build 3 stages but along the development only 2 stages remained.

Here is some pics for the other people to familiarize with this:

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More pics:
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Stage 1:
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LatinVenom · « **Reply #28 on:** January 30, 2011, 08:30:34 PM »

Well I thought the BTF large wheel was 46mm , just a little smaller than the gt2860

SKY888 · « **Reply #29 on:** February 01, 2011, 08:55:31 AM »

Quote from: Dave@DDMworks on January 29, 2011, 09:07:24 PM

Thought I would update this thread, we have been running the BNR stage 3 here for about 2 months now and here the latest dyno run from it:

That is on 93 octane, no meth/water, intercooler, high flow cat, exhaust and an intake. Most likely with an off the shelf tune most are going to be int he 355-360whp range SAE. I will update more next week!

Dave, is the tune based off GM stage 2/upgraded tune with 3 bar sensors? or not?

LatinVenom · « **Reply #30 on:** February 03, 2011, 07:19:43 PM »

Arabas.
This is what you wrote about your now SOLD Large wheel turbo.
new compressor wheel is 36.5mm vs the stock 33.5mm

Now look at the chart on post 27 by Kelu. K04 inducer stock wheel 43.3 mm.
Then what I posted about my BTF large wheel which is about 46.3 mm.
Did you make a typing error when you posted the values of your upgraded wheel?.

Arabas · « **Reply #31 on:** February 04, 2011, 02:39:40 AM »

LV you are correct, it was a typo.
43.5 vs 46.5
the 0.2 mm could have been a kinda quick measurement

IIRC i had also posted the foto from Dejon, which verifies the 43.5 of the stock

LatinVenom · « **Reply #32 on:** February 04, 2011, 03:56:20 PM »

I figured it had to be typo.
All that said if the BNR2860 wheel is 47.3mm and our Upgraded big wheel is 46.3 46.5 then I know
DDM should post a Dyno of theirs with their tune.
I would bet it cranks out about 325 - 330 WHP.

Dave@DDMworks · « **Reply #33 on:** February 04, 2011, 05:49:21 PM »

Originally there was going to be 3 stages, but now it looks like there is going to be just the 2 stages. We tested the 2860 and it was not worth the cost in our opinion, as it ended up in the mid 320's horsepower range. Which is better than the big wheel, but for a little more you can get the 2871 which netted a much better gain per dollar.

shabby · « **Reply #34 on:** February 04, 2011, 08:05:46 PM »

How was the response of the 2860 compared to the stock turbo Dave? Did you guys drive it on the street by any chance?

smarty · « **Reply #35 on:** February 06, 2011, 03:46:28 PM »

Quote from: Dave@DDMworks on February 04, 2011, 05:49:21 PM

Originally there was going to be 3 stages, but now it looks like there is going to be just the 2 stages. We tested the 2860 and it was not worth the cost in our opinion, as it ended up in the mid 320's horsepower range. Which is better than the big wheel, but for a little more you can get the 2871 which netted a much better gain per dollar.

Will this be ready for the Mod meet at Joes'?

elff · « **Reply #36 on:** February 22, 2011, 11:57:56 AM »

It still has that crazy drop off just like the Big Wheel kit.
I thought this kit was supposed to eliminate that???

kennysabarese · « **Reply #37 on:** February 22, 2011, 02:27:24 PM »

Everyone thought that with the bigger compressor and bigger turbine wheel that it wouldn't drop off as much.

My guess is that the A/R is so small that the larger turbine wheel isn't helping too much. The exhaust air is still being pushed through the same small hole and you can only flow so much through it, so you lose boost up top.

SKY888 · « **Reply #38 on:** February 22, 2011, 02:29:47 PM »

that might be the best possibility kenny....

and that's the reason, why I didn't go with a k04 turbo for my small turbo in my compound set-up.

the k04 might not be big enough....to give me the flow of power I need.

might be a totally different thing.....

but I think you're on the right track....

Critterman · « **Reply #39 on:** February 22, 2011, 04:12:41 PM »

You could always go with one of these setups:

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Pick your poison

and just for the heck of it

snaponbob · « **Reply #40 on:** February 22, 2011, 06:59:56 PM »

I like photo #1. A turbo charged work bench. Gotta love THAT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

People can add all the intake increase they make like, but the exhaust ports are a limiting factor. Those that have been flirting with high output and rev numbers north of 7000 rpm are finding out how restrictive the head is. That said, there is probably plenty that can be done from 2500 to 6500-7000.

shabby · « **Reply #41 on:** February 22, 2011, 07:05:11 PM »

Quote from: Kenny on February 22, 2011, 02:27:24 PM

Everyone thought that with the bigger compressor and bigger turbine wheel that it wouldn't drop off as much.

My guess is that the A/R is so small that the larger turbine wheel isn't helping too much. The exhaust air is still being pushed through the same small hole and you can only flow so much through it, so you lose boost up top.

You'd be surprised how much you can flow through a small turbine housing, if a small 7cm turbine housing can flow over 500awhp on a dsm then im sure ours isn't limited at the current hp level at all.

kennysabarese · « **Reply #42 on:** February 22, 2011, 08:23:56 PM »

Quote from: shabby on February 22, 2011, 07:05:11 PM

You'd be surprised how much you can flow through a small turbine housing, if a small 7cm turbine housing can flow over 500awhp on a dsm then im sure ours isn't limited at the current hp level at all.

Are you suggesting that the compressor is the limiting factor? Or something else?

shabby · « **Reply #43 on:** February 22, 2011, 09:14:53 PM »

If your talking about that bnr 2871 dyno sheet i wouldn't draw any conclusions yet, it clearly looks like a massive boost spike in the midrange.

SKY888 · « **Reply #44 on:** February 22, 2011, 10:05:49 PM »

cobalt guys are working on getting a better power band.........for the 2871

Carpe Diem · « **Reply #45 on:** February 23, 2011, 01:56:11 AM »

So far, all the discussion I see here addresses only increased power output. With these turbo upgrades, what about turbo lag? How much worse, or better than stock is the turbo lag with these upgrades?

SKY888 · « **Reply #46 on:** February 23, 2011, 07:23:15 AM »

Quote from: Carpe Diem on February 23, 2011, 01:56:11 AM

So far, all the discussion I see here addresses only increased power output. With these turbo upgrades, what about turbo lag? How much worse, or better than stock is the turbo lag with these upgrades?

the 2860 will be close to spool response of K04 turbo.......probably just a tad behind.

the 2871 will be giving more power up top......but again, will be a bit laggier than both k04 and 2860

kennysabarese · « **Reply #47 on:** February 23, 2011, 12:17:46 PM »

Quote from: shabby on February 22, 2011, 07:05:11 PM

You'd be surprised how much you can flow through a small turbine housing, if a small 7cm turbine housing can flow over 500awhp on a dsm then im sure ours isn't limited at the current hp level at all.

What are they changing to make 500whp with a 7cm turbine housing? Changing the compressor? Porting the heads?

LatinVenom · « **Reply #48 on:** February 23, 2011, 06:54:12 PM »

Kenny,
Shabby said Housing not Wheel.

shabby · « **Reply #49 on:** February 23, 2011, 08:56:03 PM »

Quote from: Kenny on February 23, 2011, 12:17:46 PM

What are they changing to make 500whp with a 7cm turbine wheel? Changing the compressor? Porting the heads?

Stock evo3 16g + supporting mods http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tuning-engine-management/292196-499awhp-16g.html
Sometimes i miss getting out of the dsm scene...

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Author Topic: Factory turbo improvement-suggestions (Read 19118 times)