Author Topic: replacing water pump. What else needed? (Read 4689 times)

SKY888 · « **on:** March 22, 2011, 10:37:05 AM »

I am replacing my 34,000 miles water pump while my engine is out

I still need to also purchase water pump seal and water tube seal (do I need to purchase 2 water tube seals)?

thanks!

Gentleman Jack · « **Reply #1 on:** March 22, 2011, 10:41:52 AM »

Coolant?

Just kidding. Have you given any thought to changing the thermostat? Either to a new one or perhaps a different temp? I know in the old days that was always something I would change out, but I'm not too sure how that effects this modern marvel of the LNF. Perhaps a 190 instead of the 210? My memory (which is really fuzzy) tells me the optimal temp for best performance is somewhere under 200? best combustion, longest lasting parts... but I might have made that up in my head over the years.

(great, now I have to go research this... damn why do I do that to myself...)

GJ

SKY888 · « **Reply #2 on:** March 22, 2011, 10:46:15 AM »

I spoke to a couple of guys, and also read some other threads. There's no hard evidence that changing the thermostat will be productive though

Gentleman Jack · « **Reply #3 on:** March 22, 2011, 11:15:41 AM »

OK, so this is what I found on an LS1 tech forum. I will predeed this quote by saying there are just as many theories for the other side of the argument, including some insite in the post immediately below this quote. The link to the post is below the quote:

Quote

Proper Coolant Temperature and Camshaft Life!

Have you ever tried to find what proper coolant temperature is for most automotive engines? There are a lot of people who think they know, but it is difficult to find specifics, even in textbooks. We know we want the intake air to be as cold as possible (for best power) because cold air is denser (there are more oxygen atoms per cubic foot). The coolant temperature, however, is a different matter. The internal combustion engine changes chemical energy stored in gasoline into heat energy that is focused on the piston tops. If the cylinder heads and engine block are too cold, they will absorb much of the combustion heat before it can be used to push the piston down the cylinder. If the engine gets too hot, engine lubricants can break down, as well as overheating of the intake charge can lead to detonation, etc.

quote continued in next post:

Gentleman Jack · « **Reply #4 on:** March 22, 2011, 11:15:59 AM »

"
It turns out that coolant (usually a 50/50 mixture of coolant and water) has some fantastic properties that are ideal for use in engines. With a properly pressurized cooling system, coolant will not freeze until –30°F, and it won’t boil until +270°F (new oils don’t start to break down until well over 270°F). With these characteristics, engine designers have decided that engines should operate at approximately 210-215°F. Why, you ask? Well, it has to do with operating the engine at a high enough temperature to boil water out of the oil after the engine is cold started. If you have dew on the grass, it is certain that you have water in your oil, as the crankcase is open to atmospheric pressure! You can either remove the water by draining it out the bottom of the oil pan (remember the oil floats on water) or run the engine long enough and hot enough to boil the water out of the lubrication system. Years ago, coolants weren’t as sophisticated and engines were run at 165-180F, but the oil was changed every 1000 miles or so. That’s why many old timers think engines should run at 165-180F. Have you ever noticed that Ford doesn’t put temperature marks on their gauges? They just mark C for cold and H for hot and write “normal” through the center. If you hook up a scan tool to a GM, you will often find that the gauge reads much lower than the coolant temp sensor. That is because they know most drivers don’t understand how hot an engine should run.

So what does this have to do with camshafts? Many enthusiasts erroneously think that the colder their engine runs the better! If they are not running the engine hot enough to boil the water out of the oil, the oil becomes contaminated and the lifter/cam lobe interface is the highest load point in the engine. Engines running too cool can contribute significantly to camshaft and lifter failure. Think about it: What good does it do to use the most expensive synthetic oil and then run the engine so cold that it is contaminated by water vapor??!! Another point, piston manufacturers’ piston-to-wall clearance recommendations assume you will be running the fully warmed engine at 200°+F. Run the engine too cold, and you could see some scuffed pistons because the cylinders had not expanded enough to provide clearance.

If your engine will only run its best at the drag strip with the engine at 165°F, you probably have too cold of a spark plug heat range and you are probably jetted way too rich! If you keep the engine hot (not the intake charge), you will be using more of the heat energy in the gasoline to make power instead of just heating up your block. It does take “tuning know-how” to run an engine at 200-210°F, but you might be surprised how well and how long it runs when you do!! One final point - running a computer managed engine at 165°F compared to the factory 210°F will often cost you as much as 4 MPG. The reason for this is that the computer thinks that the engine is not off the “choke cycle” and it is still putting out a rich mixture! Check the science on this and don’t pay attention to the “old wives tales” of the past. Materials and lubricants are much better and different today than they were in the past!! [\quote]

LINK:
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/advanced-engineering-tech/1034959-ideal-coolant-temperature.html

GJ

TomatoSoup · « **Reply #5 on:** March 22, 2011, 11:38:46 AM »

Wow. Interesting! Thank you, GJ, for that informative post.

(Wait... I can't believe I'm saying that!

)

Gentleman Jack · « **Reply #6 on:** March 22, 2011, 11:42:46 AM »

Quote from: TomatoSoup on March 22, 2011, 11:38:46 AM

Wow. Interesting! Thank you, GJ, for that informative post.

(Wait... I can't believe I'm saying that! )

suprises lurk around every corner....

Critterman · « **Reply #7 on:** March 22, 2011, 11:44:06 AM »

much as I hate to pay you a compliment, that was a good find and great information

SKY888 · « **Reply #8 on:** March 22, 2011, 01:08:16 PM »

great stuff GJ

tazz · « **Reply #9 on:** March 22, 2011, 01:34:44 PM »

Then I have a problem since my coolant as well as my engine oil hardly ever gets over 199* at least that what my DH displays. The only time Ive ever seen above 200 strange enough is in the winter with the heater on and it was 210 am going WTF but did notice when it's below 20 degrees the coolant runs hotter above 200* than if it;s warm to hot outside. Also if running over 80mph for over an hour the oil temp still rarely gets to 215.
Right now and it 70* outside my coolant and engine oil run 189-195 without the AC fan engaged and both are within 5 degrees of each other.

LatinVenom · « **Reply #10 on:** March 22, 2011, 06:46:47 PM »

GM designed our LNF to run between 190 and 200. Normal city/highway driving.
At idle depending on location as much as 230. It is usually between 200 - 207.
Our thermostat is a 180 from the factory and it should be left at that setting.

Gentleman Jack · « **Reply #11 on:** March 23, 2011, 12:29:18 AM »

LV,

Our factory thermostat is a 180? Really? I did not know that. I (wrongly) assumed it was higher than that.

SKY888,
We have nearly totally derailed your original thread. Sorry about that. The actual intent this time was to stay on topic. Yet somehow, I still veered off course...

Changing the water pump.... What else needed?

GJ
(currently basking in the glow of 3 compiments on one page in one thread. that is a record I don't think I will EVER break... wow. Today is a GOOD day...

MGar · « **Reply #12 on:** March 23, 2011, 05:28:15 AM »

Quote from: Gentleman Jack on March 23, 2011, 12:29:18 AM

LV,

Our factory thermostat is a 180? Really? I did not know that. I (wrongly) assumed it was higher than that.

Keep in mind, thermostat temperatures are usually rated at the temperature at which they begin to open, not the temperature at which they are fully open.

SKY888 · « **Reply #13 on:** March 23, 2011, 06:19:57 AM »

Quote from: Gentleman Jack on March 23, 2011, 12:29:18 AM

SKY888,
We have nearly totally derailed your original thread. Sorry about that. The actual intent this time was to stay on topic. Yet somehow, I still veered off course...

Changing the water pump.... What else needed?

no worries, I got the answers that I was looking for......right after I submitted the thread

IBDRINKEN · « **Reply #14 on:** March 23, 2011, 06:42:53 AM »

my car runs at a constant 210

Uranium-238 · « **Reply #15 on:** March 23, 2011, 07:31:18 AM »

Mine usually runs between 190-200*. I've seen it get as high as 218 after an autocross run on a 100* day.

Is it possible they have our cars running slightly cooler because they're turboed?

DeepBlueGXP · « **Reply #16 on:** March 23, 2011, 08:16:05 AM »

Mine usually hits 203-207 and the then the thermostat opens and it cools off to about 195.

Critterman · « **Reply #17 on:** March 23, 2011, 09:19:39 AM »

Mine is usually in the 189-195 range.

LatinVenom · « **Reply #18 on:** March 23, 2011, 05:11:26 PM »

Mine is usually between 190 - 198. Then at idle it goes between 200 - 207.

News:

Welcome Guest!!!

Author Topic: replacing water pump. What else needed? (Read 4689 times)