Author Topic: Differential Cooler Discussion (Read 28905 times)

40rtyp · « **Reply #25 on:** July 09, 2012, 12:23:07 AM »

Well,

I know this topic hasn't seen a person chime in a while but I couldn't justify littering the forum with a repetitive thread asking the same thing. Anyways, I have been looking into a diff cooler for a while now since I do road racing and was wondering if anyone has gotten the CTS kit on the car or if anyone made their own kit. I have to say that 1K for a cooler is pretty ridiculous.

Did Dave never consider???

spartan · « **Reply #26 on:** July 09, 2012, 12:55:27 AM »

I am still considering it. I have the Werks rear brace and have thought I might try to mount a diff cooler on it. I almost pulled the trigger on a mishimoto set-up from e-bay that was under $200 that looked like it might work but it is not the highest thing on my list to do.

40rtyp · « **Reply #27 on:** July 09, 2012, 05:14:25 AM »

Errrrrrrrrr Mishimoto quality isn't the greatest and has been known for leaks. I'm going to look up some oil coolers to see what I can come up with.

SKY888 · « **Reply #28 on:** July 09, 2012, 06:45:00 AM »

I believe Project Scarab/Joshmass already installed a differential cooler on his big turbo solstice.

I'm not sure about the specs and brand of the cooler though. Its on his facebook page...

40rtyp · « **Reply #29 on:** July 09, 2012, 06:59:00 AM »

Well, I don't have a Facebook and never will, is there another way I can lookup his build?

SKY888 · « **Reply #30 on:** July 09, 2012, 07:01:17 AM »

google project scarab........and see if you can find info about his oil cooler.

if you find it, the problem is it might be on FB...and you will not be able to access it if you dont have an account.....

wspohn · « **Reply #31 on:** July 09, 2012, 01:31:33 PM »

I have wondered why people even consider fitting these things before they find out if there is any issue.

You can buy cheap temperature sensitive 'dot' stickers from the usual racing outlets. Has anyone stuck some on their diff casings to determine whether there is an overheating issue in actual race use?

The issues involved in a 15 min. or 30 min. race will often be far different than a 2-3 hour enduro, too.

I know that many products get stuck on street cars because of a 'wannabe racer' syndrome among non-racers, but real racers (the only ones that could possibly need this product) are supposed to be much more realistic - you don't stick anything on your car and add weight unless it serves a proven need and solves a known reliability issue.

Do we have any real facts (and I don't mean simply that the manufacturer seems to think it might be a good thing to have)?

Sol Asylum · « **Reply #32 on:** July 09, 2012, 01:38:47 PM »

Quote from: wspohn on July 09, 2012, 01:31:33 PM

Do we have any real facts (and I don't mean simply that the manufacturer seems to think it might be a good thing to have)?

Yes
Fact: GJ isn't quite right and he shouldn't be allowed to drive his car in the rain.

That's at least two facts.

40rtyp · « **Reply #33 on:** July 09, 2012, 02:09:05 PM »

Quote from: wspohn on July 09, 2012, 01:31:33 PM

I have wondered why people even consider fitting these things before they find out if there is any issue.

You can buy cheap temperature sensitive 'dot' stickers from the usual racing outlets. Has anyone stuck some on their diff casings to determine whether there is an overheating issue in actual race use?

The issues involved in a 15 min. or 30 min. race will often be far different than a 2-3 hour enduro, too.

I know that many products get stuck on street cars because of a 'wannabe racer' syndrome among non-racers, but real racers (the only ones that could possibly need this product) are supposed to be much more realistic - you don't stick anything on your car and add weight unless it serves a proven need and solves a known reliability issue.

Do we have any real facts (and I don't mean simply that the manufacturer seems to think it might be a good thing to have)?

Him, At most I only do 30min track sessions but it on multiple tracks every other weekend. I am interested in using these "stickers" you mentioned. Can you point me in the direction of one of these outlets you speak of? Thanks and I agree with your statement. I think that the reason it was brought up was because SCCA spec'd Solstice was produced and a diff cooler was used. I'm sure that they did testing and determined that maybe a cooler was needed. Does anyone have the Performance Handbook? Thanks

wspohn · « **Reply #34 on:** July 09, 2012, 02:20:21 PM »

Here is one brand (there are several) http://www.palmerwahl.com/product_home.php?cat=5&catl=15&line=155&itm=109

3/4" x 1 3/4" and a range of dots from 150 deg. through 300 deg.

40rtyp · « **Reply #35 on:** July 09, 2012, 03:32:37 PM »

Wow, awesome. Thanks you!

LatinVenom · « **Reply #36 on:** July 09, 2012, 04:34:13 PM »

Also you may want to ask Dave from Werks if he has one on his race coupe?.

Dave@DDMworks · « **Reply #37 on:** July 09, 2012, 06:52:57 PM »

Quote from: wspohn on July 09, 2012, 01:31:33 PM

I have wondered why people even consider fitting these things before they find out if there is any issue.

You can buy cheap temperature sensitive 'dot' stickers from the usual racing outlets. Has anyone stuck some on their diff casings to determine whether there is an overheating issue in actual race use?

The issues involved in a 15 min. or 30 min. race will often be far different than a 2-3 hour enduro, too.

I know that many products get stuck on street cars because of a 'wannabe racer' syndrome among non-racers, but real racers (the only ones that could possibly need this product) are supposed to be much more realistic - you don't stick anything on your car and add weight unless it serves a proven need and solves a known reliability issue.

Do we have any real facts (and I don't mean simply that the manufacturer seems to think it might be a good thing to have)?

The dots will definitely give you a general idea if you need to look into something for the diff. You could also install a diff temp gauge to monitor it, if you are concerned about it. Also that way if you do a cooler later you will be able to monitor how effective it is with different radiator placements.

http://autometer.com/cat_gaugedetail.aspx?gid=2607&sid=7

NormSky · « **Reply #38 on:** July 09, 2012, 08:53:18 PM »

It was design for the CTS-V which was just around 3700 lbs and had two exhaust emitting heat on each side of it.

hammy221 · « **Reply #39 on:** July 10, 2012, 10:59:35 AM »

For me once I do my build to my car I'd be interested in a diff cooler but of course 1k is a little steap can anyone on here do it for less with out sacrificing quality and still make something on them. Also how's the fluid kept from over filling the diff as there has to be more in thre so the system can circulate it. Was thinking maybe a check valve so when the car isn't running there isn't a over flow or back up to swap out the seals

wspohn · « **Reply #40 on:** July 10, 2012, 11:32:40 AM »

Quote from: NormSky on July 09, 2012, 08:53:18 PM

It was design for the CTS-V which was just around 3700 lbs and had two exhaust emitting heat on each side of it.

In other words, the Kappa may well not need another thousand bucks thrown at the diff unless you just like bragging rights and a bit more weight.

We need someone to actually check on what the temperatures reach and in what sort of use before assuming that a cooler is a GOOD THING.

miller11386 · « **Reply #41 on:** July 10, 2012, 12:17:41 PM »

if the TTB class racers dont use them/ have them, I cant imagine you having more load on your diff than those guys do road racing.

Could be wrong, but I think good fluid and changing it under heavy use would be more than adequate. However real world data is key.

wspohn · « **Reply #42 on:** July 10, 2012, 12:21:27 PM »

Quote from: miller11386 on July 10, 2012, 12:17:41 PM

if the TTB class racers dont use them/ have them, I cant imagine you having more load on your diff than those guys do road racing.

Could be wrong, but I think good fluid and changing it under heavy use would be more than adequate. However real world data is key.

Good point.

I've switched over to synthetic diff lube (on everything except a couple of cars where an LSD or overdrive unit doesn't like anything that slippery) and they run significantly cooler than dino oil. Running Red Line diff oil may be all you need.

miller11386 · « **Reply #43 on:** July 10, 2012, 12:26:38 PM »

redline oil is a godsend for rear diffs.

Also the LSD additive isnt a bad idea either.

I would still be interested in seeing how hot one could get. I would recommend asking dave from werks to install one or someone in the NASA/SCCA club races. I dont think AutoX is really long enough to cook the fluid.

Mihela816 · « **Reply #44 on:** July 10, 2012, 02:24:29 PM »

What happens in diffs and transmissions for that matter is localized overheating of the fluid at the surface of the gear teeth. Checking the overall temperature won't tell you that the fluid is cavitating at the gear face. Cooling the fluid helps keep the fluid circulating and keeps temps in check. Synthetic oils have to get a lot hotter to boil.

Kelu · « **Reply #45 on:** July 10, 2012, 05:44:38 PM »

The GT was on the dyno for some hours, inside temp even with HUGE ventilation system was around 104F, the differential blew some oil, not much but it made a 6" spot.

It didn't blew until now.

Sol Asylum · « **Reply #46 on:** July 10, 2012, 08:08:24 PM »

Quote from: Kelu on July 10, 2012, 05:44:38 PM

The GT was on the dyno for some hours, inside temp even with HUGE ventilation system was around 104F, the differential blew some oil, not much but it made a 6" spot.

It didn't blew until now.

And he just had the floor painted too.

jlab8 · « **Reply #47 on:** July 13, 2012, 08:35:36 PM »

I have one. I didn't take temps before and after, but I went from having a bumper, diffuser and rear end covered in gear oil mist after driving, and gear oil coming out black after a few thousand miles to a clean rear end.

Gentleman Jack · « **Reply #48 on:** July 13, 2012, 10:32:56 PM »

Quote from: jlab8 on July 13, 2012, 08:35:36 PM

I have one. I didn't take temps before and after, but I went from having a bumper, diffuser and rear end covered in gear oil mist after driving, and gear oil coming out black after a few thousand miles to a clean rear end.

A clean rear end is good enough reason for me! I hate it when my rear end is covered with black mist.

GJ
always on topic.

jlab8 · « **Reply #49 on:** July 14, 2012, 01:27:57 AM »

You also need to complete the tsb that relocates the differential vent, but the factory recommendations don't work in practice. The nipple remaining after removing the cap is too short to make a reliable connection, so I had a custom nipple machined to make a secure connection. That required dropping the differenial, and at that point, putting in a cooler wasn't a big deal. I'm sure that the team @ BlackTrax.net will be more than happy to sell anyone a kit of what was installed on my car.

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Author Topic: Differential Cooler Discussion (Read 28905 times)