Topic: What a clutch swap looks like

[snaponbob]

From a mechanical standpoint can you think a way make the engagement later?

Besides wait a half hour?   

In the case of the LNF, a thicker spacer. Don't know about how the 2.4 is rigged. Sure don't want to pull the trans again. ZZP sells an adjustable pushrod for the Cobalt, so I may try that first (assuming it will fit).

[idkfa]

Man you really make this sound like it's not a fun maintenance

I'm not going to do the flywheel but I really need to swap out my clutch...

[snaponbob]

Man you really make this sound like it's not a fun maintenance

I'm not going to do the flywheel but I really need to swap out my clutch...

Don't recall if you have a 2.0 or 2.4. Either way, if you are replacing a clutch, you really should install a new flywheel. The reason is that a new clutch should have a new surface to mate to. The decision should then be whether or not a light flywheel or stock one. Stock flywheel means no issues with pedal engagement points, while a lightweight flywheel means quicker engine response. I know what is happening with the situation on the 2.0, but not the 2.4. If you have a 2.0, here is a source for an OEM flywheel and clutch for cheap --- http://stores.ebay.com/Source-One-Auto-Parts/Transmission-and-Drivetrain-/_i.html?_fsub=1584671016&_sid=297930046&_trksid=p4634.c0.m322

[Critterman]

Why not just have your flywheel resurfaced at a machine shop?

[Dave@DDMworks]

Why not just have your flywheel resurfaced at a machine shop?

The stock 2.0L flywheel is a dual mass setup which most machine shops will not touch, since the center of the flywheel can rotate independent of the outside.

On the 2.4L cars you can get a new flywheel for less then $70, and with most shops charging around $50 here to resurface it, it is easier to just get a new one and not have to remove the stock one, take it to get machined, wait for it to get returned, etc.

[NormSky]

A pair of skinny forearms are the only thing you can't buy to do this swap. Harbor Freight transmission jack, jack stands, metric wrenches/sockets/extensions, breaker bar for the diff bolts, and a tall floor jack to get the car high enough to move the transmission out of the way once it's removed.

If you have the extra $300 for a flywheel you'll love it. It feels really natural in the 2.4.

[miller11386]

SOB,

Did you notice any difference in the RPM run up / down with the new lightened fly wheel?  I am still wanting to see 2 side by side videos of with a stock and lightened flywheel. Curious if it really makes a difference or not.

[snaponbob]

SOB,

Did you notice any difference in the RPM run up / down with the new lightened fly wheel?  I am still wanting to see 2 side by side videos of with a stock and lightened flywheel. Curious if it really makes a difference or not.

The engine IS more responsive. That said, sudden decrease in revs creates pollution problems, so modern ECMs control throttle opening and closing, even on tuned engines. When I have lightened flywheels on small displacement carbed engines (1.5 Civic and 3.5 TR8) by about 40% the difference was very noticeable. On the 2.0 the 12 pound flywheels are less than half the 27 pound dual mass flywheel, yet the closed throttle shut down is slower - may be other rotating masses at play such as the counter rotating balance shafts as well as the ECM controlling the throttle valve. If the transmission is out, it is worth the extra.

[Kelu]

Bob: May I some info about the tool and procedure for bleeding?

[snaponbob]

Bob: May I some info about the tool and procedure for bleeding?

Using my IKUT ( International Kappa Universal Translator), I assume you meant "May I HAVE some"  . If the IKUT is correct, I used a sink stopper (IIRC about 1 3/4" [45mm for YOU] size) from a hardware store. I drilled a hole in it. Then, I grabbed my handy dandy vacuum tool http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=all&item_ID=86830&group_ID=1421&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog and a cone shaped hose adapter stuffed in the hole. Pull about 10" of vacuum and release. Repeat a few times, and start pumping the clutch pedal. Pray, and repeat !!!!!!!! According to DDM (and others) sometimes the clutch starts working right away, and sometimes times it can take quite some time.  So .... good luck.

BTW, so far, I have found nobody that has a Spec clutch/flywheel that does NOT have a low pedal. DDM says almost all of their installs are like that. The people at Spec apparently do not a) document phone complaints, b) haven'y gotten any since you and contacted them last week, or c) are full of shit. I will be installing the Werks plate behind the Spec spacer (using SLIGHTLY longer bolts than the Spec bolts.

[Kelu]

Yes, I forgot to type the word have, my bad.

Thanks for the info, where did you attached the sink stopper, to the reservoir?

When you say sink stopper you refer to something like this, right?
[attachimg=1]
And to sink stopper attached the hose from vacuum pump to it using an adapter, right?

(Sorry for the bogus questions, I'm just trying to be sure).

Here is the info which I got from SPEC:

If the pedal is on the floor then you need to insure that the system is fully bled.  I suggest the use of a mighty-vac to bleed the system.  You will need to attach this to the bleeder off the slave and to the reservoir up top too.  Additionally, can you check the fluid in the reservoir?  Is it dark or discolored?

[snaponbob]

No bogus questions so far !!

That IS the item. I trimmed the tab for the ring and drilled a hole with a 3/16" bit. I then used a cone shaped hoes end piece from the vacuum kit and stuffed it in the hole.

As for the response from Spec, we don't HAVE  a bleeder on the slave. Of course, the slave is IN the bell housing. Dumasses !!!!!!! And the clutch fluid is also the brake fluid as they share the same reservoir. Dumasses !!!!!

Irritating, but they have the only available stuff for our cars.

[miller11386]

The engine IS more responsive. That said, sudden decrease in revs creates pollution problems, so modern ECMs control throttle opening and closing, even on tuned engines. ....Snip...On the 2.0 the 12 pound flywheels are less than half the 27 pound dual mass flywheel, yet the closed throttle shut down is slower - may be other rotating masses at play such as the counter rotating balance shafts as well as the ECM controlling the throttle valve. If the transmission is out, it is worth the extra.

So you would buy it again? Is there anything you can do tuning wise to give you more response? IE edit the throttle blade position table?

[snaponbob]

So you would buy it again? Is there anything you can do tuning wise to give you more response? IE edit the throttle blade position table?

Fixed that "quote" for ya!!!

In order -

Yes, I would buy it again only because choices are SO limited. Sort of the only game to play.

Will/can tuning fix the residual throttle response? Maybe. But, look out for what you ask for. Couple the power the Ecotec engine CAN make with a short wheelbase and one can have a real problem on their hands on track and street. As a "for instance", my "rains" are mounted on stock wheels BECAUSE they are heavier than after market wheels. Why? SLOW down response in wet conditions.