Author Topic: passenger airbag (Read 10635 times)

smacmoyle · « **on:** January 07, 2013, 05:07:17 PM »

Got the airbag light, got the passenger seat out, got the overpriced sensor out, before I pluck down the $368 for a new one and then pay a dealer $125 to program it, Does anyone have any new ideas to get out of this with less financial pain ?

Thanks,
Scott

smacmoyle · « **Reply #1 on:** January 07, 2013, 05:19:41 PM »

Anybody have an old seat or seat cushion near NJ ?

TomatoSoup · « **Reply #2 on:** January 07, 2013, 05:22:36 PM »

No - but if you want to send me the old one when you've replaced it, I'd like to take a look to try to see what goes wrong and if it could be repaired. (I'd pay shipping)

Critterman · « **Reply #3 on:** January 07, 2013, 07:33:06 PM »

Contact Joe or Alex at JPMCoachworks in Atlanta, one of the sponsors of this board. He should be able to help you out.

smacmoyle · « **Reply #4 on:** January 07, 2013, 09:43:09 PM »

Thanks for the tip. PM sent. $378.25 is the lowest price I can find for new. What a kick in the man parts. I took apart what I could. The circuit looks fragile, lots of sensors or switches and a computer box.

smacmoyle · « **Reply #5 on:** January 21, 2013, 08:03:57 PM »

Update.... $385 for the part on ebay. Free shipping. $107 to program.. Thats a lot of dough but at least it works.

idkfa · « **Reply #6 on:** January 30, 2013, 12:04:50 PM »

That sucks man, there's one for sale on here right now for $250 but I bet it's nice to not see that error every time you start (I haven't had my car inspected in a few years because of it).

You going to take TS up on this?

Quote from: TomatoSoup on January 07, 2013, 05:22:36 PM

No - but if you want to send me the old one when you've replaced it, I'd like to take a look to try to see what goes wrong and if it could be repaired. (I'd pay shipping)

Man, I've started I-don't-know-how-many-PMs to you about various approaches to this. I'm pretty sure you were the first to turn me onto SWCAN in general - do you have something that will talk (or listen) on that bus? After reading so many GM-LAN hack sites, building a small module to spoof this message has been on my mind for years.

GODROD · « **Reply #7 on:** February 01, 2013, 10:36:22 PM »

JOIN US IN RECALL EFFORT:

In case you were unaware this has been a hot button issue on another forum (search there: DIC service airbag). Many of us have moved to putting in a complaint with the NHTSA to try and force a recall. Links are there (but i included it here too) and a GM customer service rep does monitor that.

Here is the link but have your serial number handy:

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/

SOLODIO,

GODROD

TomatoSoup · « **Reply #8 on:** July 12, 2013, 03:48:29 PM »

Looked into a failed passenger airbag sensor mat, sent to me by a guy from Israel on the BB. Found that they're unrepairable

More detail and photos at:
http://www.solsticeforum.com/forum/f12/panssenger-airbag-sensor-75353/index5.html#post1126319

(Heh, when searching for this thread to post this update on, I found that Kenny had already taken photos of the mat. Doh! http://www.kappaperformance.com/forum/index.php?topic=4677.0)

Topdowneh · « **Reply #9 on:** July 13, 2013, 08:27:55 AM »

Quote from: GODROD on February 01, 2013, 10:36:22 PM

JOIN US IN RECALL EFFORT:

In case you were unaware this has been a hot button issue on another forum (search there: DIC service airbag). Many of us have moved to putting in a complaint with the NHTSA to try and force a recall. Links are there (but i included it here too) and a GM customer service rep does monitor that.

Here is the link but have your serial number handy:

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/

SOLODIO,

GODROD

Here is the link for Canadians: Transport Canada.

Sent my complaint in yesterday.

https://wwwapps.tc.gc.ca/Saf-Sec-Sur/7/PCDB-BDPP/Index.aspx

2kwk4u · « **Reply #10 on:** July 13, 2013, 04:37:37 PM »

TS, I suspect the failures may indeed be in the sensor array itself. As I stated in Kenny's thread (the one you linked above), the sensor mat looks similar in design to the horn trigger in my Saturn VUE. Those also fail often and require replacement of the AIRBAG to repair, as GM won't sell the sensor as a separate part. I dismantled the airbag to effect my repair in that car rather than shell out $600 for a new airbag for a car that's worth maybe $3,000.

TomatoSoup · « **Reply #11 on:** July 13, 2013, 05:40:14 PM »

Crud. I hate to say this, but you are correct, Scott.

I'd only opened-up the front half of the sensor mat, and it was intact and looked pretty robust. After your post (although I was mentally poo-poohing your statement) I opened up the rear part of the mat and found a couple of, what seem to be more-fragile, cross-links. One of which was broken and the other had the start of a break! These are the ones in the middle of the photo from Kenny below.

However, I tried to scrape the PCB to do a wire-solder repair and couldn't. Seems the tracks are VERY thin - probably conductive paint - and will NOT take any solder, they just melt away. You can't even scrape to get enough surface for a conductive paint/glue repair. Crap.

I go back to update the BB thread with photos.

2kwk4u · « **Reply #12 on:** July 14, 2013, 07:58:25 AM »

Best solution may wind up being to sort out a way for an on/off switch that mimics the signal from the sensor to the BCM... That or see if another GM product has a more robust sensor mat that we can substitute as these fail. Some other car that was available in much higher volume than ours *should* have more affordable sensors given economies of scale.

Sly Bob · « **Reply #13 on:** July 14, 2013, 08:06:52 AM »

Quote from: Topdowneh on July 13, 2013, 08:27:55 AM

Here is the link for Canadians: Transport Canada.

Sent my complaint in yesterday.

https://wwwapps.tc.gc.ca/Saf-Sec-Sur/7/PCDB-BDPP/Index.aspx

Great info, thanks for posting and welcome to the forum!

TomatoSoup · « **Reply #14 on:** July 14, 2013, 02:09:51 PM »

OK, updating this here for those that don't read the BB.

I think the issue is a mechanical design flaw in the sensor mat. The tight shape of the loop, and the location right in the middle is (I believe) what is causing the flex-cracks. I took another picture to help illustrate my theory, taken while lightly pulling-apart the sensor mat, so you can see the distortion in the loop...

My Theory: As you sit on the seat, the cushion flexes down, stretching the sensor mat across its width. Because of the 'cut-out' design, the only place that stretching can be accommodated is the two cross-connect loops, which pull apart the long arms of the loop(s), widening and thus stressing the tight radius of the loop (blue arrow). That pulling on the tight radius starts the split and then it just continues across the whole width as the process repeats when folks get in and out of the seat. Obviously, heavy weight, or concentrated pressure, will just accelerate the process. You can see the start of a crack in the unbroken loop, just at the orange arrow head.

LatinVenom · « **Reply #15 on:** July 14, 2013, 04:13:40 PM »

Maybe the seat sensors on a Cobalt would the same and been a much larger production vehicle might be more robust.
The other suggestion would be that German company that sells the whole package for about $100.00.

DeepBlueGXP · « **Reply #16 on:** July 16, 2013, 08:58:31 PM »

TS, perhaps you can wire it so it's on all the time.

Arabas · « **Reply #17 on:** July 17, 2013, 02:37:06 AM »

Quote from: DeepBlueGXP on July 16, 2013, 08:58:31 PM

TS, perhaps you can wire it so it's on all the time.

this would be the best solution!

TomatoSoup · « **Reply #18 on:** July 17, 2013, 09:56:47 AM »

Quote from: DeepBlueGXP on July 16, 2013, 08:58:31 PM

TS, perhaps you can wire it so it's on all the time.

Something like that was what I was looking for when I went in to this. I thought maybe I could bypass the sensor mat somehow and fool the controller. Unfortunately, that doesn't seem possible.

You'd have to design an emulator that talks on the GMLAN and sends the correct data stream. I'm not gonna try that

Sly Bob · « **Reply #19 on:** July 19, 2013, 04:25:29 PM »

Oh where's your sense of adventure Mark!

cdflint · « **Reply #20 on:** July 19, 2013, 06:21:03 PM »

So I can blame my 90lb daughter and *Eehm* lb wife for sitting the passenger seat and busting it out?

Sol Asylum · « **Reply #21 on:** July 19, 2013, 07:33:31 PM »

Quote from: Sly Bob on July 19, 2013, 04:25:29 PM

Oh where's your sense of adventure Mark!

Who are you kidding? We know he's good just not that good.

TomatoSoup · « **Reply #22 on:** July 19, 2013, 11:14:52 PM »

Stand back, I'm gonna roll out my Bill the Cat graphic again.

U4EA · « **Reply #23 on:** July 20, 2013, 08:13:59 AM »

Quote from: cdflint on July 19, 2013, 06:21:03 PM

So I can blame my 90lb daughter and *Eehm* lb wife for sitting the passenger seat and busting it out?

Had mine replaced twice under warranty after kneeling in the passenger seat to drop the top. I run about 160lb, compressed to the surface area of my knee toasted mine.

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Author Topic: passenger airbag (Read 10635 times)

Topdowneh