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Author Topic: 2014 Recall for the Ignition Switch 2006/2007 Kappas  (Read 55294 times)

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Offline nolanb

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2014 Recall for the Ignition Switch 2006/2007 Kappas
« on: March 02, 2014, 03:46:38 PM »
So, What does everyone think about this ignition Switch recall?  Not that I will consider doing anything about it until Spring.

http://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/news.detail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2014/Feb/0225-ion.html

GM Expands Ignition Switch Recall
2014-02-25
◾Chevrolet HHR, Pontiac Solstice, and Saturn Ion and Sky included
◾Company Launches Process Review
DETROIT – General Motors is expanding the recall of certain 2003-2007 model year vehicles to correct a condition with the ignition switch that may allow the key to unintentionally move or switch to the “accessory” or “off” position, turning off the engine and most of the electrical components on the vehicle.

In addition to 2005-2007 Chevrolet Cobalts and Pontiac G5 and Pontiac Pursuit sold in Canada only, GM is separately recalling 2003-2007 Saturn Ions, 2006-2007 Chevrolet HHRs, and 2006-2007 Pontiac Solstice and 2007 Saturn Sky models. The affected U.S. vehicle population, including those vehicles recalled Feb. 13, totals 1,367,146.

This expanded vehicle population raises the number of reported incidents involving frontal crashes, in which the recall condition may have caused or contributed to the non-deployment of the frontal airbags, to 31 involving 13 front-seat fatalities. 

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/21/automobiles/gm-recalls-some-cars-but-not-all-with-ignition-switch-problem.html?_r=0


http://www.dallasnews.com/business/business-headlines/20140225-gm-adds-another-588000-cars-to-ignition-recall-older-solstice-saturn-sky-now-included.ece

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2014/02/28/gm-recall-opel-daewoo-switch-airbags/5903055/



« Last Edit: March 13, 2014, 07:11:05 PM by DeepBlueGXP »

Offline Sly Bob

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2014, 05:42:01 PM »
Is the part number on the 2008+ models different? Must be...
Just trying to do my part...

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Offline solli

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2014, 09:28:33 AM »
I was thinking it's a sad thing they kept it under wraps and it took that mother to bring it to light. I've never had a problem with my ignition switch maybe because the production was October, 2005 so I'm not sure I'll replace it. I do have a problem with my passenger side door handle though.  Didn't the 2008's have problems with it?

Offline Sly Bob

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2014, 09:39:08 AM »
If my car was covered I'd change it even if I'd never had an issue as I plan on having the car for a long time. I never refuse free stuff.   :D

On my Solstice key ring I have the the key and the fob.
Just trying to do my part...

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Offline Derf

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2014, 11:23:47 PM »
Took my Solstice in for service today on another problem. Talked to the service manger about this, according to him GM is recommending having nothing on the key not even the fob  :nuts:

Offline Sly Bob

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2014, 11:40:21 PM »
They are just following the letter that GM no doubt sent them and are erring on the side of caution. As the fob likely weighs no more than the key I wouldn't sweat it but that's just me.
Just trying to do my part...

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Offline POS VETT

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2014, 11:52:46 PM »
Over cautious

Offline ihawk95

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2014, 12:47:45 PM »
Agreed.  They are linking 13 deaths to this and they certainly don't want any more.

Offline ChopTop

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2014, 02:27:32 PM »
I plan on taking the 06 in but I more concerned about cosmetic damaged occurring.  I read they knew about the issue for years, maybe it fell under the lawsuits vs recalls financial study.

Offline TomatoSoup

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2014, 03:53:49 PM »
What recall?  There's a recall?









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Offline WWI Flying Ace

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #10 on: March 05, 2014, 05:06:31 PM »
I only have a couple keys on my key chain but I'll still do it.  I will keep the car a long time, and if I ever let it go it will be to give it to my daughter.  I'd have a hard time giving her a car with a known problem that might make the airbag unreliable.  And, if it is ever sold on, the person that buys it will want to know that the recall was done.  Its free after all...no reason not to get it done.

What I find strange is that I'm signed up on the NTSB site to get notifications of recalls for all our cars, and yet I found out via the media, and have yet to get the message from the Gub-Mint that there is a recall, even though its been a week or so since it was announced.

Offline ChopTop

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #11 on: March 05, 2014, 08:53:26 PM »
What recall?  There's a recall?:devil:


I remember reading about a car company (Ford?) who knew about a defect back in the 70s/80s?  and had a financial study performed to find out if it was cheaper to perform a recall & repair vs pay off the number of potential injured victims who sued them.  The study found it was cheaper to pay victims if they sued.  Then several years later a class action lawsuit was brought against them and the study was revealed during the lawsuit.  It was a big scandal at the time because no one was thinking a company would actually be so cold to leave it to a financial study on how to handle a safety defect issue.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2014, 09:12:50 PM by ChopTop »

Offline POS VETT

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2014, 09:21:29 PM »
It was GM I believe.  The problem was the side-mounted fuel tank on the trucks rupture during a side-impact collision causing fire.

Offline WWI Flying Ace

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #13 on: March 06, 2014, 10:41:45 AM »
Wasn't it for Pintos?  When the turn signal was flashing, if there was a rear end collision at just the right time, it could ignite the gas. 

I'm not "Occupy" person, but it is alarming, to say the least, to think that corporations would conduct studies and come to this as the "best solution".  Where is the moral compass?  Would the executives that signed off on these decisions let their children ride in those cars?  It was one thing when it was in the 70s and 80s, but the fact that GM did it with Solstices and other recent cars is even more astounding.  And let's not forget Toyota's recent escapades and cover ups.  Amazing.

Offline ihawk95

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #14 on: March 06, 2014, 11:52:43 AM »
The Pintos were earlier...the 70's.  I did a product liability paper on the Pinto years and years ago.  If memory serves, the Pinto's had a fuel tank that was located in the very rear of the car so it was not protected during a rear end crash.  Also the neck design was such that it would be severed from the tank during a crash.

And yes, Ford did have a new design fuel design, but they did a cost/benefit analysis and decided not to implement the new design.

I believe GM did something similar with the trucks.  I remember that side mounted tank in the light duty trucks in the 80's.  Seems like an old classmate's Dad wrecked his under a railroad overpass and it caught on fire and killed he and his passenger.  That truck had a side mounted tank.  It was a pretty big deal in the local papers. I can't remember if GM did the same thing and chose not to recall the trucks or what.  I'll have to do a little research on it.

Offline TomatoSoup

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2014, 04:16:56 PM »
Heheh...

"That is my theory, it is mine, and belongs to me and I own it, and what it is too." (Monty Python)

Offline Sly Bob

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2014, 06:04:50 PM »
GM has been sent a document from the NHTSA requesting additional information on the recall, reams of information pertaining to 107 questions they have. You can read the document here. The specific questions start on page 10 of the document.

http://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/communications/pdf/2014-03-04_Special_Order_Directed_GM_LLC.pdf
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Offline TomatoSoup

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #17 on: March 06, 2014, 07:01:48 PM »
GM has been sent a document from the NHTSA requesting additional information on the recall, reams of information pertaining to 107 questions they have. You can read the document here. The specific questions start on page 10 of the document.

http://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/communications/pdf/2014-03-04_Special_Order_Directed_GM_LLC.pdf
Holy crap.  This is just stupid.  Big brother bureaucracy making themselves feel important.  Asking a bunch of stupid questions that just cost money to answer in triplicate and don't do anything to help the situation.  Aggggh!
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Offline ChopTop

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #18 on: March 07, 2014, 11:10:11 AM »
I believe the investigation is valid (but not the circus that surrounds it).  GM knew about the issue since 2004 (Red flag #1), failed to implement changes schedule for 05 (Red flag #2), and was aware of 13 deaths, 23 crashes (Red flag #3, you're out). 

Though it is possible that GMs impending financial implosion was impacting business operations way farther back than the company was aware of.  Along with being reported that the ignition switch was not the primary factor in some of the accidents and deaths (i.e. alcohol, drugs, speed, etc).  But none of that matters when its being investigated using a 20/20 hindsight mentality.  I am not trying to excuse poor management as much as wanting someone to find out why, and who was responsible for allowing it to happen.  Everyone?  No one?

Some entity has to be a watchdog over business's, if not the government, who?

It will be interesting to see if a woman CEO (Mary Barra) has the chops (and bigger cojones) then the boys in resolving GMs latest nightmare.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 01:54:54 PM by ChopTop »

Offline Sly Bob

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2014, 01:52:50 PM »
There is another article in "Automotive News" today as follows.

http://www.autonews.com/article/20140310/OEM11/303109950/the-early-warnings-that-gm-missed


The early warnings that GM missed

DETROIT ; Ten years ago, two General Motors engineers reported that the ignition switch on the Saturn Ion was so flimsy and so low on the steering column that the driver's knee could easily bump the key and turn off the car.

"This is a basic design flaw and should be corrected if we want repeat sales," one of the engineers wrote in January 2004 as part of GM's Company Vehicle Evaluation Program.

But not only did GM fail to correct the flaw; it installed the same switch on the Chevrolet Cobalt that the company introduced that year, proclaiming a new era of higher-quality small cars. It kept using the switch until 2006, when it was quietly redesigned.

For years, as drivers complained that their Cobalts and Ions were stalling repeatedly, GM treated it as a matter of customer satisfaction, not safety. Documents show that the company either didn't grasp the significance of the problem or didn't consider it worthy of resources.

A 2005 entry in GM's complaint-tracking system blamed drivers' bad habits: "They hit the ignition key slot."

Proposals considered before the Cobalt went on sale were vetoed "after consideration of the lead time required, cost, and effectiveness of these solutions," GM said in a detailed timeline filed Feb. 24 with federal regulators.

The decade-long lead-up to a recall, during which at least 13 people died in crashes linked to the defect, appears, in the best case, to be a tragic byproduct of GM's famously siloed culture, which stymied the sort of interdepartmental communication and data sharing that could have prompted quicker action. Compounding the chances for a serious defect to go unresolved for so long was the fact that GM eliminated one-third of its white-collar work force from 2005 through 2009.

'Acted without hesitation'

Mary Barra, who became GM's CEO in mid-January after three years as head of product development, said she learned of the problem just before the first stage of the recall was issued last month.

"When this was brought to my team a few weeks ago, we acted without hesitation to go well beyond the decision by the technical experts," Barra wrote in a message to GM employees last week.

GM announced an initial recall on Feb. 13 then expanded it Feb. 25. Overall, GM is recalling 1.6 million vehicles worldwide, including 1.4 million in the United States. The models are the 2003-07 Ion, 2005-07 Cobalt, 2006-07 Chevrolet HHR, 2006-07 Pontiac Solstice, 2007 Saturn Sky, 2007 Pontiac G5, 2005-06 Pontiac Pursuit (Canada only) and 2007 Opel GT (Europe only).

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, which is investigating whether GM acted quickly enough, has given the company until April 3 to answer 107 questions about its handling of the recall. GM says it is cooperating with the investigation and has hired an outside law firm to conduct an internal review.

Before issuing the recall, GM communicated little with customers about the issue unless they complained.

At least 12 times, GM bought back Cobalts from customers who reported frequent incidents of stalling that dealers could not fix, according to a June 2013 deposition of Victor Hakim, a senior manager in GM's Field Performance Assessment department. The company sent a service bulletin to dealers in 2005 and developed a small plastic key insert designed to reduce the chances that a heavy dangling key ring could inadvertently turn off the engine. The key inserts were made available to customers who complained. GM said its warranty claims data show that only 474 customers received one.

In other cases, GM and its dealers essentially told customers that their expectations of a $13,000 car were too high.

"There is nothing mechanically wrong with the vehicle," reads an entry in GM's complaint-tracking system following up on an October 2005 complaint from a Cobalt owner in Gettysburg, Pa., according to the deposition of Hakim. "It is the customer's driving habits. They hit the ignition key slot."

Airbags won't deploy

The Cobalt recall is linked to reports of 23 frontal-impact crashes in which airbags failed to deploy. Six of the crashes -- two of which involved drunken driving -- resulted in the deaths of eight front-seat occupants, at least three of whom were age 16 or younger. At least one crash also resulted in the death of a back-seat passenger.

The most recent fatality that GM has linked to the Cobalt recall occurred in December 2009. GM doesn't consider the 2010 death of 29-year-old Brooke Melton to be connected to the recall because hers was not a frontal-impact crash, though black-box data suggest the ignition switch in her 2005 Cobalt stopped airbags from deploying.

Five additional deaths are linked to crashes involving the Ion, which GM added to its recall on Feb. 25. GM expanded the recall six days after Lance Cooper, the Georgia lawyer who represented Melton's estate in a lawsuit against GM, asked NHTSA to investigate GM's handling of the recall and pointed out that more vehicles used the same ignition as the Cobalt.

Poor communication

GM said its employees learned of many of the Cobalt crashes now linked to the recall within a month of each one happening. But that information didn't always spread within the company, as shown by the handling of a July 2005 crash in Maryland that resulted in the first fatality now linked to the recall.

NHTSA's Special Crash Investigations unit began examining the Maryland crash in mid-August 2005, and GM said its legal staff opened a file related to the crash in September 2005.

A 16-year-old girl, Amber Marie Rose, died when the 2005 Cobalt she was driving hit a tree at the end of a residential cul-de-sac. Rose was drunk, not wearing a seat belt and driving nearly three times the 25 mph speed limit, according to the NHTSA report on the crash.

The airbags did not deploy, and black-box data showed that the ignition was in "accessory" mode, instead of "on," when the crash occurred. Her mother, in an interview last month with radio station WTOP in Washington, said paramedics told her at the time "if the airbags had gone off, [Rose] would have been alive today; she would have been injured, but she would have been alive."

NHTSA issued its report on the crash in February 2006. When NHTSA brought up its findings during a March 2007 meeting with GM about airbags, the GM employees present were unaware of the crash.

At that point, GM assigned an engineer to track frontal-impact crashes involving Cobalts in which the airbags failed, and it had discovered 10 such incidents by the end of that year. It learned that the ignition had been turned from "on" to "accessory" mode in four of the 10 crashes.

New key in 2009

GM's timeline shows no further action on the issue until February 2009, when it opened an internal inquiry that resulted in a redesign of the ignition key for the 2010 Cobalt, the car's last model year. Engineers determined that the new key design -- a change the company had approved four years earlier, then canceled -- would "significantly reduce downward force and the likelihood of this occurrence."

By the time GM filed for bankruptcy protection on June 1, 2009, it had collected black-box data from 14 frontal-impact Cobalt crashes showing that the ignition was in "accessory" mode when seven of them occurred. Of the 23 crashes that GM now links to the recall, it has data showing that the ignition was in "run" when just nine of them occurred, in "accessory" for 12 of them, and off for one.

GM has not released details about the crashes it knows about, so it's unclear whether the numbers include the crash involving Chandra Smallwood, who was trying to beat an approaching hailstorm as she headed home from work on the beltway around Fort Worth, Texas, in April 2008. She said Interstate 820 was still clear and dry when she lost control of her 2007 Cobalt and slammed into a concrete median at about 65 mph. She suffered bruises and back injuries, and her brother, in the front passenger seat, was knocked unconscious and taken to a hospital.

"It smashed up the whole front end of the car, all the way to the tires, but the airbags never deployed," Smallwood, 28, told Automotive News last week. "The insurance agency said there's no way it couldn't be a defect."

But the dealership at which she had bought the Cobalt a year earlier told her there was no recall for her car. Smallwood said she tried contacting GM directly but never received a reply.

Secret design change

It appears the recall would have included far more than 1.6 million vehicles if not for a design change in 2006 that almost no one at GM knew about until last October.

GM said its design engineer responsible for the Cobalt ignition switch, which was supplied by Delphi Mechatronics, signed a document on April 26, 2006, approving a new detent plunger and spring that created more torque, making it harder to switch the key position.

But because the part number did not change, GM for years was unable to figure out why the reports it was getting of crashes without airbag deployment involved vehicles only from 2007 or earlier. (Delphi itself was in bankruptcy proceedings from 2005 through 2009 and cutting thousands of jobs.)

Charlie Miller, the owner of a Mississippi auto repair shop who was hired by the Melton family's lawyer, discovered the design change while performing a mechanical analysis of the Cobalt involved in the 2010 crash. A new switch Miller bought from GM had almost double the torque as the one in Melton's Cobalt, he said in an interview.

A 2012 GM internal review failed to find an explanation for the low torque in 2007 and earlier Cobalts, but an outside expert hired by GM in April 2013 found the same differences Miller had noticed. On Oct. 29, about a month after Melton's family reached a confidential settlement with GM, Delphi provided GM with records documenting the 2006 design change.

GM subsequently tested and analyzed the old switch, and the matter reached the team of senior executives who decide on recalls in December. The team, known as the Executive Field Action Decision Committee, requested more analysis, then approved a recall on Jan. 31, 2014.

Heavy keychains

GM said it would begin sending recall letters to customers today, March 10.

Until the affected vehicles have their ignition switches replaced, GM is urging owners to remove everything from their key rings but insists the vehicles are safe to drive.

"People have been driving them all along," GM spokesman Alan Adler said last week. "There should be no issues with driving the vehicles."

GM had almost the same message in 2005 when several journalists test driving the Cobalt reported experiencing the car stalling. A service bulletin GM sent to dealerships in 2005 said owners "should be advised of this potential and should take steps to prevent it -- such as removing unessential items from their key chain."

"When this happens, the Cobalt is still controllable," Adler told New York Times reviewer Jeff Sabatini for a story published June 19, 2005, explaining why GM did not consider the problem a safety issue.

"The engine can be restarted after shifting to neutral. Ignition systems are designed to have on and off positions, and practically any vehicle can have power to a running engine cut off by inadvertently bumping the ignition from the run to accessory or off position."

Gary Heller, writing in The Daily Item in Sunbury, Pa., said the engine on the Cobalt he tested shut down four times in a week.

"I never encountered anything like this in 37 years of driving," Heller wrote. "I hope I never do again."

GM cited both articles in its timeline filed with NHTSA, as well as a June 26, 2005, column in the Cleveland Plain Dealer skewering GM for trying "to pretend that turning off the engine by mistake isn't a safety issue."
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 02:53:33 PM by Sly Bob, Reason: added link to original article »
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Offline TomatoSoup

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2014, 02:23:50 PM »
Nice find, Bob!

Key section from your article, for those worried about their 2008/9/10 cars (posted this on the other fora too):

Quote
Secret design change

It appears the recall would have included far more than 1.6 million vehicles if not for a design change in 2006 that almost no one at GM knew about until last October.

GM said its design engineer responsible for the Cobalt ignition switch, which was supplied by Delphi Mechatronics, signed a document on April 26, 2006, approving a new detent plunger and spring that created more torque, making it harder to switch the key position.

But because the part number did not change, GM for years was unable to figure out why the reports it was getting of crashes without airbag deployment involved vehicles only from 2007 or earlier. (Delphi itself was in bankruptcy proceedings from 2005 through 2009 and cutting thousands of jobs.)

Charlie Miller, the owner of a Mississippi auto repair shop who was hired by the Melton family's lawyer, discovered the design change while performing a mechanical analysis of the Cobalt involved in the 2010 crash. A new switch Miller bought from GM had almost double the torque as the one in Melton's Cobalt, he said in an interview.

A 2012 GM internal review failed to find an explanation for the low torque in 2007 and earlier Cobalts, but an outside expert hired by GM in April 2013 found the same differences Miller had noticed. On Oct. 29, about a month after Melton's family reached a confidential settlement with GM, Delphi provided GM with records documenting the 2006 design change.

GM subsequently tested and analyzed the old switch, and the matter reached the team of senior executives who decide on recalls in December. The team, known as the Executive Field Action Decision Committee, requested more analysis, then approved a recall on Jan. 31, 2014.
"That is my theory, it is mine, and belongs to me and I own it, and what it is too." (Monty Python)

Offline ChopTop

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2014, 12:10:11 PM »

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #22 on: March 11, 2014, 12:12:25 PM »
With a little planning and help from a willing government, looks like anything is possible.
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Offline WWI Flying Ace

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #23 on: March 11, 2014, 02:50:22 PM »
Ain't that the truth! 

Offline fiziksgxp

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Re: Has anyone thought about this new Recall for the Ignition Switch?
« Reply #24 on: March 12, 2014, 05:20:20 PM »
I got my letter Safety Recall from GM today ... for my 2007 GXP.

 

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