Topic: Twincharged Solstice = Turbocharger + Supercharger

[Steelmesh]

Been playing with this idea in my head for a few months.  I picked up a LSJ intake and LSJ M62 SC off ebay pretty affordable.  Slowbalt on the Cobaltss forum has had success with his twincharged setup with an LE5.  What really got me going was seeing a twincharged prototype inside an OEM test facility, it is running right now.   

I'm calling this my anti-lag HP multiplier device. The intake fits, need to delete the A/C and get a FWD dipstick.  The biggest challenger here is cutting and welding the SC housing, as you can tell the TB is in the firewall.


If this is going down, you will know.  Anything can happen with enough time and money, so I am working on the latter.

[Sly Bob]

looking forward to seeing the results of a project not without its challenges.

[wspohn]

Pointless exercise if the turbo is sized correctly.  The only time twin charging is helpful is if the turbo is large enough that it it is outside it's envelope of operation at low rpm, in which case the supercharger covers that area until the rpm get into the best range for the turbo.

If one does a bad job selecting a turbo, then twin charging may help correct the situation; otherwise, a properly chosen turbo for the street will nicely cover the lower range as well - heck, on the LNF the program is written to limit torque in first gear so you don't trash the driveline.

If you are going all out competition, ignore the foregoing and go for it.

[elff]

I agree
If you need a supercharger to cover a turbo on a Kappa, that Turbo is well beyond the strength of even a built Kappa engine.
At that point, your better off doing an engine swap.

[elff]

weird how you're is corrected to your

[Sol Asylum]

weird how you're is corrected to your

Must be an Apple thing.

[Steelmesh]

I am looking at this PTE 5862 with the 0.82 A/R, this would be for a 2.4 LE5/LEA: http://realstreetperformance.com/Turbo-Parts/Billet-Series/Precision-Turbo-Billet-CEA-5862-640HP-Turbocharger.html

If this is the case the SC would make sense assuming I don't want any lag, which I don't.  My HP dream here is 600 bhp.  I will risk the driveline, as my understanding is folks put an LS in front of the stock system, so I'm sure torque is higher out of that setup. 

Worst case is, it doesn't work so I sell the SC bits and learn from all the challenges.  I bought this car as a platform to learn tuning and play with boosted I4's.  I will still have a built LE5/LEA and a big laggy turbo in the end that should be able to peak close to my power goal.

[wspohn]

Why  don't you work with the turbo first, and if you don't blow up your engine and if you find that you have a big hole in the torque curve, install a helper supercharger once the turbo is working reliably. Doing both at the same time complicates things and makes it more expensive, and runs the risk of more money down the tube if the turbo alone kills your engine.

[Steelmesh]

Why  don't you work with the turbo first, and if you don't blow up your engine and if you find that you have a big hole in the torque curve, install a helper supercharger once the turbo is working reliably. Doing both at the same time complicates things and makes it more expensive, and runs the risk of more money down the tube if the turbo alone kills your engine.

As far as expense, it is a bolt on supercharger from the same family LSJ, I already found the intake for $200 and the SC for $180.  There are a few more big details like a water pump and heat exchanger.  All other investments would be unrelated to this.  I pay myself all of the labor, so I am always coming out ahead in-lieu of paying someone to do this job, not to mention all the lessons learned along the journey.  My guess is, a race shop would do this for me for $4,000 plus parts.

[Gentleman Jack]

I think it will be a cool thing to try!

[elff]

It's definitely a cool project and at one point, I was interesting in the same thing. But it's a heck of a lot of hardware to eliminate lag in first gear.  Once you hit boost in first gear, you can maintain it throughout the remaining 4 gears.   
The timing chain is the weak link on all chain driven 2.0L engines.  I am not sure of there is an available aftermarket one that is stronger, but I was not aware of one for the LNF.   On top of that, anything above 600HP isn't going to survive for long on 1st gen blocks.

[2kwk4u]

It's definitely a cool project and at one point, I was interesting in the same thing. But it's a heck of a lot of hardware to eliminate lag in first gear.  Once you hit boost in first gear, you can maintain it throughout the remaining 4 gears.   
The timing chain is the weak link on all chain driven 2.0L engines.  I am not sure of there is an available aftermarket one that is stronger, but I was not aware of one for the LNF.   On top of that, anything above 600HP isn't going to survive for long on 1st gen blocks.

weird how interested is corrected to interesting 

[Sol Asylum]

It must be an auto correct because we all know Elff is too short to be interesting.

[Steelmesh]

Why  don't you work with the turbo first, and if you don't blow up your engine and if you find that you have a big hole in the torque curve, install a helper supercharger once the turbo is working reliably. Doing both at the same time complicates things and makes it more expensive, and runs the risk of more money down the tube if the turbo alone kills your engine.

wspohn, you're right, and you're steps ahead of me.  I agree with you now, the new bigger turbo should be shaken down, then play with the SC stuff after turbo by itself is known working good.

[Steelmesh]

It's definitely a cool project and at one point, I was interesting in the same thing. But it's a heck of a lot of hardware to eliminate lag in first gear.  Once you hit boost in first gear, you can maintain it throughout the remaining 4 gears.   
The timing chain is the weak link on all chain driven 2.0L engines.  I am not sure of there is an available aftermarket one that is stronger, but I was not aware of one for the LNF.   On top of that, anything above 600HP isn't going to survive for long on 1st gen blocks.

I am running an LE5, for the more proper build planned, I will get a 2.4L LEA block and install LE5 parts to finish it. 

For the lag, while cruising at higher speeds, dropping a gear and waiting to punch it...these My-Little-Pony cars always get the jump on me. 

[Gentleman Jack]

My little pony has a car?

[2kwk4u]

[Gentleman Jack]

That is awesome. Would only be better if it was a wagon.

[Steelmesh]

Yes, I would include the BMW V8s in that category

[Sol Asylum]

Well no wonder they get the jump on you than.

[elff]

6HP??

[Gentleman Jack]

(Image removed from quote.)


6HP??

Nope 6PP!!!!!

[Sol Asylum]

What's the conversion ratio between HP and PP?

Ponies are like 2/3 of a horse?

[Steelmesh]

I haven't actually seen one of these in person, but I hear UP is close to something like 10x HP (correct if wrong)

[Sol Asylum]

That's all kinds of F'd up!

Unicorns don't have wings, Pegasus don't have horns.