Topic: Bigger turbo, more aiflow but not more HP?!

[miller11386]

sorry.. i meant 30 psi... and you are making 20-25psi at 4500!?? that's a kickass big turbo you have there my friend!

However the turbo wont spool as well with the bigger AR housing you are going to put on. I bet you will see your spool numbers go 500rpm higher with the .82 over the .64 

yes... mountains are fun. I prefer the female mountains as well as the HP mountains, however both are very nice when they have the right shape

[Kelu]

sorry.. i meant 30 psi... and you are making 20-25psi at 4500!?? that's a kickass big turbo you have there my friend!

yes

However the turbo wont spool as well with the bigger AR housing you are going to put on. I bet you will see your spool numbers go 500rpm higher with the .82 over the .64

Theoretically I agree with you but will see the facts, I base this on the tune update which was not made previously

[miller11386]

best of luck! i cant wait to see how the anti-lag/ 2step works with your big turbo setup

Your GT will come off of the start line like a monster!

[Kelu]

Yeah, spinning all the way with these tires )

[miller11386]

https://secure.buschurracing.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1790&osCsid=144458603ee581509883f532b1b2faa8

Not with those

[Kelu]

I am racing in street category so I'm no allowed with slicks, my tires needs to have DOT/E regulation.

I desperately want a set of street slicks like Mikey Thompson, Nitto, etc but the shipping is killing me.

[miller11386]

really? no one over there has slicks? Thats just weird.

I cant wait because buschur is up the road and plans to stock these slicks

[elff]

Kelu

Could you use 275s on the rears and still be in the same class?

[shabby]

Sure: http://www.compturbo.com/products/ct4billet/ct4_6767

If you plan on sticking in the 4-500hp range i would of went with a .48 ar housing for quick spool, the .84 is too big unless you're going to be pushing that sized turbo to its limit and shooting some laughing gas.

[Arabas]

Kelu, as you said, the most important change will be to have a proper tune, made on the dyno.
can't wait to see the results!!
this GT will be a hell of a "just married" car!!!

[SKY888]

If you plan on sticking in the 4-500hp range i would of went with a .48 ar housing for quick spool, the .84 is too big unless you're going to be pushing that sized turbo to its limit and shooting some laughing gas.

yup I agree.

the bigger turbine AR housing he will be using.....will just cause lag, especially will be felt during daily driving.

Kelu shouldve just stayed with his original AR turbine housing which is already good for his set-up and drag racing events, IMO.


But we'll see what happens during the tuning sessions.


Kelu.....while you guys are tuning with your bigger AR turbine housing.....can you quickly go back to your original AR (smaller) and see how it reacts?   I think you have this new tuner tuning your set-up anyways.   He might be able to produce wonders with your original AR.

[elff]

Our cars drive extremely well out of boost.
IMHO, that will make his car behave like an NA 2.4 for cruising around town with the potential to open up some serious top end power.
That's not necessarily a bad thing.  It will also have excellent cruising and daily driving gas mileage.

[Arabas]

Kelu, i remember you have a spare gearbox laying there...
why don't you change the 3rd, 4th and 5th ring with shorter ones. having a "closer" gerabox would get you at the high rpm range faster than our stock when shifting.
i don't mean to start a new thread by this, i just propose what i think would be good for your big turbo setup

[SKY888]

Our cars drive extremely well out of boost.
IMHO, that will make his car behave like an NA 2.4 for cruising around town with the potential to open up some serious top end power.
That's not necessarily a bad thing.  It will also have excellent cruising and daily driving gas mileage.

IMO, the LNF is "ok" out of boost.     I won't be buying the SKY...if it behaves as a 2.4 on the streets, and daily driving.

I liked the quick spooling stock turbo, and instant response of the engine....that's why I bought it from the dealership after I test drove it


I've tried both .63 and .84 AR turbine housing on a GT3582r.    And I noticed dramatically the difference in spool time especially just driving around town.   The bigger AR turbine housing is very sluggish and laggy...........although once on the highway WOT.........you can feel the difference in power!

with Kelu's bigger turbo (compared to gt3582r).........I am assuming now that going from a small turbine to a bigger turbine............he'll feel the lag even further compared to what I noticed.


But since Kelu's primary focus is drag racing.........going with a bigger turbine AR housing will probably the best for his set-up!   

[elff]

You learn where the power is and drive it accordingly.  I am not talking about racing around town, I am talking about nice smooth comfortable driving, especially in stop and go traffic.

In your compound setup,  I always wondered why you didn't keep the K04 for your first turbo.  It has better down low response then the one you are adding as your first turbo and it's mid to top end performance would not matter because your second turbo will be taking over at that point.  The first turbo is just setting up the second turbo. 

Kelu's has a specific end game in mind with his setup.  if this doesn't hit it, then, like the rest of us, he will adjust accordingly.

I think its funny that he has been able to procure a turbo, and then procure modified parts for that same turbo in months less time than the EFR.   

[SKY888]

I just dont like the NA kappa's driving response and power, city normal driving or highway.
But some people like it.   To each his own 

I didnt use K04 for my compound set-up because I need a small turbo that can flow around 45lb/min to match the big turbo 85lb turbo.    Anything less than 45lb, then some "choke" will occur.    The gt2871r will spool fast and have a good response in the streets....due to its ball-bearing and small housing.

k04 + gt3582r compound set-up will be good!

Like what I said, Kelu's main purpose is drag racing.   All it matters is WOT during that event, and his new set-up probably will be a better choice for more power and less back pressure.

With ARs the rule applies.   The smaller the AR, faster spool, less power.  The bigger AR will be laggier, but more power.    There's always a compromise.....

[elff]

So it is 100% sequential and you are flowing through the first turbo even when the second turbo is delivering the power?

Kelu's setup should also aid in his launches.

Well I can say for sure my Turbo setup trumps both of yours and here is why.
I drove my car to work today.
 

I will wait for the  response
 

So what timing are both of you looking at now for full implementation?

[SKY888]

So it is 100% sequential and you are flowing through the first turbo even when the second turbo is delivering the power?

Kelu's setup should also aid in his launches.

Well I can say for sure my Turbo setup trumps both of yours and here is why.
I drove my car to work today.
 

I will wait for the  response
 

So what timing are both of you looking at now for full implementation?

I'll PM you my response.  I dont want to clutter kelu's thread

[miller11386]

Kelu, I meant to ask before, (cant remember if you answered or not. what kind/ size of external wastegate are you using? Also is the dump tube going back in the exhaust or is it a dump to atmosphere pipe?

[Kelu]

really? no one over there has slicks? Thats just weird.

There are some cars with slicks but they race to Profi category, which means not street legal.

Could you use 275s on the rears and still be in the same class?

I can use whatever width I want as long it is on 18" or even on 17" (The car was delivered with 18" wheels but it accepts as legal wheel on 17" too)

If you plan on sticking in the 4-500hp range i would of went with a .48 ar housing for quick spool, the .84 is too big unless you're going to be pushing that sized turbo to its limit and shooting some laughing gas.

My aim is 400hp, maybe if everything works out great, during the winter, upgrade internals and head and push to 500hp. No laughing gas even I still have the system around here, it is a waste to use it in these conditions.

What most of us don't understand, including me, is this turbo is comparable as power delivery with GT42, which normally delivers 15psi above 5000rpm on a stock engine and pump gas, right? But this one delivered 15psi under 4000rpm which is almost unbelievable, we might have surprises about this aspect.

Kelu, as you said, the most important change will be to have a proper tune, made on the dyno.
can't wait to see the results!!
this GT will be a hell of a "just married" car!!!

crazy malaka, should I wrap it in white? 

Kelu shouldve just stayed with his original AR turbine housing which is already good for his set-up and drag racing events, IMO.

Doing 360hp with this turbo is not right at all. If the bigger turbine housing is a fail, than use a different turbo. Sagga continues.

Kelu.....while you guys are tuning with your bigger AR turbine housing.....can you quickly go back to your original AR (smaller) and see how it reacts?   I think you have this new tuner tuning your set-up anyways.   He might be able to produce wonders with your original AR.

Yes, they have both at the garage and a skilled mechanic, the problem is the previous turbine housing wasn't "original" at all, it was a custom order by my greek tuner.

Our cars drive extremely well out of boost.
IMHO, that will make his car behave like an NA 2.4 for cruising around town with the potential to open up some serious top end power.
That's not necessarily a bad thing.  It will also have excellent cruising and daily driving gas mileage.

To tell you the whole story from the beginning: When I bought this car my decision was to make it to 400hp and street friendly, when I saw is not possible with simple bolt-ons even with a modified K04 turbo than I started to think to other options, when I decided to go bigger turbo most of all I was afraid of turbo lag.
After having this turbo on my car and daily drive it for 6 months I don't care about lag, LNF in na form is enough to drive around in city, I enjoy a lot.
I always hated the tq peak at 3000rpm with stock turbo (400tq) during the street driving, I had to go adjustable coilovers, Z0K bars and better tires.
For the moment I don't care for lag too much as long I can launch this car nicely at the drag races.

Kelu, i remember you have a spare gearbox laying there...
why don't you change the 3rd, 4th and 5th ring with shorter ones. having a "closer" gerabox would get you at the high rpm range faster than our stock when shifting.
i don't mean to start a new thread by this, i just propose what i think would be good for your big turbo setup

I though to that but is not an easy swap and money is the biggest enemy. I couldn't find stronger and shorter 3rd & 4th rings plug&play for our cars.

I think its funny that he has been able to procure a turbo, and then procure modified parts for that same turbo in months less time than the EFR.   

"BULLS EYE"
Comp turbo was answering to all calls/emails from my tuner, they delivered the turbine housing in 2 weeks and because was a wrong one, another one arrived in 1 week. I don't want to remember the experiences with Borg Warner and Full Race

Did I mentioned that the fastest romanian car made by my local greek tuner uses comp turbo? 8.88s on romanian tracks 

So what timing are both of you looking at now for full implementation?

What? I didn't get that one.

I'll PM you my response.  I dont want to clutter kelu's thread

Go ahead Antonio, I don't mind at all 

Kelu, I meant to ask before, (cant remember if you answered or not. what kind/ size of external wastegate are you using? Also is the dump tube going back in the exhaust or is it a dump to atmosphere pipe?

I can't remember the size of the wg, is an external Tial ordered for this turbo. Dumb is going back in the downpipe.

[SKY888]

all I want is for Kelu....to start beating other non-kappa cars in drag racing in his country!

I know most of Kelu's headaches with his build since last year from Nitrous set-up...to EFR...to this turbo.   

And I'm happy to find out that things are going the right way this time

[Gentleman Jack]

Key-loooooooo,

Why so many problems my friend?  It would have been cheaper and easier just to ship your car to DDM.  I hope you get this figured out soon.  I want to see you take Pizza Boy to school on the race track.  I'm predicting a 12.23 at 111.4 mph (179.2 kph). It would be faster, but your tracks are not always great.

 I think you should buy an old 500 Abarth as your daily driver so you don't rack up too many miles on the GT.  I think a man your size fits nicely in a mini car... Or am I confusing you with Elff again?  You two look so similar....

[elff]

So what timing are both of you looking at now for full implementation?

Translation-> When do you think the installation and tuning will be finished?

[elff]

 I think you should buy an old 500 Abarth as your daily driver so you don't rack up too many miles on the GT.  I think a man your size fits nicely in a mini car... Or am I confusing you with Elff again?  You two look so similar....

I'm the tall one.  Kelu is smaller than a midget.

[Kelu]

Cheaper than I have now it couldn't be. I have a barter with the greek tuner because I build his site and I administer it, I will pay some in the end when I will be satisfied by the result but mostly to cover his prices of the parts.

12.2s is way too optimistic on romanian tracks. On US strips maybe but here the aim is 12.XXs for this season, launching will be a lot more harder with the new setup.