Kappa Performance Forum
Community => Supporting Vendors => DDM Works => Topic started by: Dave@DDMworks on August 12, 2010, 06:31:21 PM
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This is one of those projects that we have been working on for awhile now as some of you know. I have not been completely happy with the fitment in the past, that is until now. I am very happy with the fitment of the new brace and the stiffness it adds. Below are a couple of sneak peak photos of the brace. We are getting pricing back on it tomorrow (Friday) and will start taking pre-orders once we have final pricing. A couple notes on it - you can not use the stock plastic on the engine, and if you have a 2.0 LNF turbo motor you will need to relocate the Power Steering reservoir (possibly may be able to bend the bracket to make it work, but not sure as we do not have any cars here without the power steering reservoir already relocated). We will be offering a package deal with the power steering relocation and the cross bay brace. We have verified fitment on a 2.0L LNF, 2.4L supercharged car and 2.4L naturally aspirated with GMPP intake. I will get the weight and testing data also put up once we have pricing also. If there are any other questions, let me know!
(http://ddmworks.com/top_secret_stuff/crossbaybrace1.JPG)
(http://ddmworks.com/top_secret_stuff/crossbaybrace2.JPG)
(http://ddmworks.com/top_secret_stuff/crossbaybrace3.JPG)
(http://ddmworks.com/top_secret_stuff/crossbaybrace4.JPG)
(http://ddmworks.com/top_secret_stuff/crossbaybrace5.JPG)
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Dave, as you know, I am restricted (by SCCA rules) from relocating the reservoir. If there IS a way of installing the brace by bending stuff, I want one. Please let me know.
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I have had one of the earlier version ones on my car for a long time and the fit has been spectacular! It does a real nice job stiffening up the front end. It's a high quality product and I fully recommend it to everyone!
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Dave, as you know, I am restricted (by SCCA rules) from relocating the reservoir. If there IS a way of installing the brace by bending stuff, I want one. Please let me know.
:agree:
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I def want one but do you think you can find another spot to mount the catch can you installed..
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Dave ; Will they come in other colors like the Star Burst ?
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I volunteer for fit testing on 2.0 turbo with stock PS location :) Send one out, I will check fitment, bend as needed, move little bits and pieces until it is perfect and send photos all along the way.
Also, could you paint mine pink?
GJ
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I am interested in one. :thumbs:
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I volunteer for fit testing on 2.0 turbo with stock PS location :) Send one out, I will check fitment, bend as needed, move little bits and pieces until it is perfect and send photos all along the way.
Also, could you paint mine pink?
GJ
He had that offer a LOOOOONG time ago !!!!!!!
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Dave ; Will they come in other colors like the Star Burst ?
Sorry but you must be kidding, it's under the freakin hood, Dave make them ALL PINK!
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Maybe Santyclause will bring me one for Christmas. :)
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Can I be the tester for Opel GT and PS in stock location? :rofl:
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Sure looks a lot different from the original design I had on my car. If it fits, ship!
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Does it fit with the DDM S/C systems? If so, I am in. Found my next mod, yeah!!!
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Sure looks a lot different from the original design I had on my car. If it fits, ship!
won't help you pass inspection
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CT_Solstice: look closer in those pictures ;) the yellow one looks SC to me
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I assume we can get this powercoated different colors, and when are you talking orders.
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won't help you pass inspection
read the other thread again, that is the Frontier that is acting up.
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I already have the Power Steering reservoir relocation kit, so all I would need to order is the brace...can't wait.
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See it now, thanks! I definitely will be getting in on this little venture. I have been looking at locking up the front end for a while and I think this may do the trick!
CT_Solstice: look closer in those pictures ;) the yellow one looks SC to me
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SCCA have many rules that are stupid and this is clearly one of them. This is why many people race with other sanctioning bodies Moving the brake reservoir helps keep the brake fluid cooler and the brakes probably safer. Since I have a roll bar the DDM under carriage brace probably wouldn't help my car but this may add to my track performance. Good idea DDM. So SnaponBob. cut a hole in the bace and fabricate bracing to support it. Any good car fabrication shop can do it easily.
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Count me in for one if they can ship powdercoated black.
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First
SCCA have many rules that are stupid and this is clearly one of them. This is why many people race with other sanctioning bodies Moving the brake reservoir helps keep the brake fluid cooler and the brakes probably safer. Since I have a roll bar the DDM under carriage brace probably wouldn't help my car but this may add to my track performance. Good idea DDM. So SnaponBob. cut a hole in the bace and fabricate bracing to support it. Any good car fabrication shop can do it easily.
First, it's the P/S reservoir. Second, not knowing how this fits at the reservoir, I am not sure what is needed. I am leaving that judgment call to Dave for the moment. Last, whether or not the SCCA rule set is odd (and there is plenty that is), it does not matter. They are the rules I have to live with. Given that only SCCA has a FULL national Solo program, and in the midwest there is nothing else, that is what I have to work with.
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Sorry but you must be kidding, it's under the freakin hood, Dave make them ALL PINK!
You must be speaking of G/J or spicy with under hood PINK Mine will be Black star Burst
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Who Knows ? There is already enough interest :D MayBe it could start a Super Performance " GROUP BUY " It could happen just maybe . Please DDM give it some Deep Thought :thumbs:
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I can almost guarantee that most people doing those inspections have no clue where the original WAS/IS unless there are two cars there and the other one is stock.
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We did get the pricing back for the brace and it is going to be less than I told some people originally. :yay:
The Cross Bay Brace is $240
The P/S relocation kit is $75
The first batch of these we are going to give a discount to everyone that buys -
First Batch of Cross Bay Brace's - $200
or get the brace and a P/S relocation together for -$250 :thumbs:
The braces are going to come in red and black at the same price for the first batch only, then they will be available in black only.
Website ordering will be up on Monday, the first batch of braces are slated to ship the week of August 30th.
We are giving everyone on Kappaperformance first crack at these and will release it to the big board on Tuesday.
Thanks again,
Dave
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Woo hoo!
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I want one also. I sure can find more things I want and not enough money to go a round.
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wold it be possible to get in that flat black instead of the gloss
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Hey Dave how about the selling the brace and the coil cover as a set, sence you need to remove the plastic cover.
Thanks
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The P/S relocation kit is $75
Have you guys thought of a p/s oil cooler kit? Not sure i want to spend $75 for some lines that give me more capacity when the stock cooler is a piece of junk. After one ax run my ps pump started whining already.
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Have you guys thought of a p/s oil cooler kit? Not sure i want to spend $75 for some lines that give me more capacity when the stock cooler is a piece of junk. After one ax run my ps pump started whining already.
Have you changed to Redline synthetic p/s fluid? Fixed that symptom on mine and many others.
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No i have not, seems like a cheap and easy fix though.
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No i have not, seems like a cheap and easy fix though.
You have a PM.
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Dave can I get the Brace in the StarBurst to match the coil cover on this special ?
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Pretty sure it's RED or BLACK. I have some pink paint for anyone who wants a special addition. The paint work will be free. Just cover shipping both ways and you will get a beautiful piece of art after 5-7 days. For an additional fee of $1.00 that will be donated to charity, if will be autographed by the artist.
GJ
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Dave how many will you be making in the first batch.
And Bubble gum I just may take you up on your offer to paint mine pink when I get one.
Hee Hee
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Please explain the difference between a shock tower brace and a chassis brace like Werks and it's affect on handling for the car.
Also you mentioned numbers to share about how much stiffer etc. Thanks!
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Kenny would you buy JFM?
Look at the car from the front, chassis has cross member to mount the engine and support the suspension, Adding a brace here will stiffen it a bit, how much? I don't think any figures have been provided.
From the lower braces the strut tower are mounted and the tops are mounted in to basically body metal. So as you slam around corners they move, how much I don't have a clue. I do know that the concept of a top brace is used in all forms of racing to stiffen the front suspension and tie it together. In some applications a rear top brace is used as well.
DDM said they will provide figures, so I would wait for them to finish their testing for those figures. I don't think they are going to be testing the Werks unit tho, that would be up to Werks to provide the figures on their brace.
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Kenny would you buy JFM?
Look at the car from the front, chassis has cross member to mount the engine and support the suspension, Adding a brace here will stiffen it a bit, how much? I don't think any figures have been provided.
From the lower braces the strut tower are mounted and the tops are mounted in to basically body metal. So as you slam around corners they move, how much I don't have a clue. I do know that the concept of a top brace is used in all forms of racing to stiffen the front suspension and tie it together. In some applications a rear top brace is used as well.
DDM said they will provide figures, so I would wait for them to finish their testing for those figures. I don't think they are going to be testing the Werks unit tho, that would be up to Werks to provide the figures on their brace.
JFM?
I don't expect DDM to test the Werks brace, I know theoretically, the two parts are not meant to accomplish the same goal, I was curious to hear Dave's thoughts on this.
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Thought we could order today....I don't see it on the web site yet.
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DRM, as i can understand you can order by emailing DDM or by sending a pm.
you don t have to wait for it to get on their site.
it is an offer to members of this forum to get it first
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Kenny,
JFM Just #$%^ magic :)
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The website page is being worked on and will be up this afternoon to allow pre orders, I will make an announcement when it goes up :)
Thanks,
Dave
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Actually the chassis brace and the tower brace in our cars are pretty much equal.
Why, because in our car the tower and the chassis are the same part. The tower is welded to the frame.
The one that I designed and is been in my car for the last 2 month provides the same level of stiffens to the front of the car.
By the way mine does not required any changes like the one from Werks, mine is a very simple install.
All that said, mine will end up been a one of, since I really do not want to compete with DDM's tower brace.
I designed it to be an alternative to the Werks front chassis brace, that requires professional installation and also some other changes.
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The one that I designed and is been in my car for the last 2 month provides the same level of stiffens to the front of the car.
By the way mine does not required any changes like the one from Werks, mine is a very simple install.
All that said, mine will end up been a one of, since I really do not want to compete with DDM's tower brace.
I designed it to be an alternative to the Werks front chassis brace, that requires professional installation and also some other changes.
:ttiwwp: (for comparison purposes only)
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No pictures will be provided.
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Kenny,
JFM Just #$%^ magic :)
it's usually called PFM
TS, this thread is for DDM so LV won't continue his discussion here any longer.
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TS, this thread is for DDM so LV won't continue his discussion here any longer.
Sure, I understand. I was thinking that seeing as LV wasn't selling anything in competition, it would be OK.
It would be nice to see how his compares, but never mind.
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Another thread would be cool for a direct comparison of brace offerings for the Kappa.
My original question was intended to ask Dave for an explanation between two different categories of stiffening devices, shock tower vs chassis, not a direct product comparison.
Critter pretty much answered my question, but I was hoping Dave might be able to go into detail on the way the characteristics of handling would change.
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Just placed my order for a Black brace on the DDM Works Web site....thanks...can't wait.
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The brace is officially up on the site:
http://www.ddmworks.com/solstice/suspension/cross_bay_brace.html (http://www.ddmworks.com/solstice/suspension/cross_bay_brace.html)
Sales pricing is for the first 20 braces only, after that the price goes back to the regular price.
Thanks!
Dave
PS - the color option of red or black is being added as we speak. If you do not see it when ordering just put the color you want in the order comments box, thanks!
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Another thread would be cool for a direct comparison of brace offerings for the Kappa.
My original question was intended to ask Dave for an explanation between two different categories of stiffening devices, shock tower vs chassis, not a direct product comparison.
Critter pretty much answered my question, but I was hoping Dave might be able to go into detail on the way the characteristics of handling would change.
The brace that goes along the front of the engine (Werks) is to be considered more of a ladder brace for the chassis, what we are introducing is a brace to tie the shock towers from side to side together. We have not done testing on any ladder brace on the kappa platform like the Werks brace, so I will not speculate on how effective it is. Also there is already a ladder brace a little further up on the frame rails, it is a large aluminum bumper and since the Werks brace and the earlier similar DC Sports bar are on the market, we did not see the reason for developing anything along those lines. We instead chose to stay with the development of a true cross bay brace/shock tower brace because it ties the upper shocks to each other and closes out the "U" that is left open by the lower motor cradle, suspension and frame rails. Also the cross bay brace is in direct line of the force of the spring on the shock pushing and pulling on the chassis, instead of being in front of that force. When we did the same testing on the brace that we did with the backbone brace and although this brace does not provide the same benefit as the backbone, a difference is able to be measured and that difference is consistent. This is not the first brace we are recommending when upgrading the cars chassis, but the benefit of the brace is a nice upgrade over stock. The result is tighter, quicker turn in response and also better feedback from the steering inputs to the driver.
Hope that helps!
Dave
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So I looked at the photos again prior to ordering, and then went out to look at my car. No way you can mount this thing with the PS fluid reservoir in place and no way you can bend the bracket enough to move it out the way. The thing is *right* smack in the way of the right hand bracket.
So where does your relo kit put the reservoir and what is included?
UPDATE: (Bad) photo here of the reservoir from a photo I already had:
[attachment=1]
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You can clearly see the ps reservoir in the first pic in the first post, seems like it fits.
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Hope that helps!
Dave
Thanks for the info. I know lots of cars have these things, so about time ours does!
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The P/S relocation kit puts the reservoir above the battery away from the heat of the engine. Same kit we have been using with the supercharger kits since we started with those and have also installed them on several LNF cars. The kit consists of a bracket, hardware, hose barb, 3/8" oil hose, 5/8" oil hose (do not use radiator hose) and the instructions to complete the relocation.
Thanks,
Dave
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You can clearly see the ps reservoir in the first pic in the first post, seems like it fits.
That is on a 2.4L car, I am checking if you can do the same thing with the LNF this afternoon.
Thanks,
Dave
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if you look at my occ pic you can see that mine was relocated as well.
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pm sent...
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So I looked at the photos again prior to ordering, and then went out to look at my car. No way you can mount this thing with the PS fluid reservoir in place and no way you can bend the bracket enough to move it out the way. The thing is *right* smack in the way of the right hand bracket.
So where does your relo kit put the reservoir and what is included?
UPDATE: (Bad) photo here of the reservoir from a photo I already had:
(Attachment Link)
Here's a pic of my relocation kit installed:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/43695877@N05/4904905318 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/43695877@N05/4904905318)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4102/4904905318_bc953d035f_b.jpg)
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That is on a 2.4L car, I am checking if you can do the same thing with the LNF this afternoon.
Thanks,
Dave
Just about to pull the trigger... Dave, any more news on not having to relocate the PS resevoir?
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I am sending a prototype to Snaponbob next week, it looks like you may be able to get away without relocating the P/S reservoir on the LNF cars with some slight bending of the bracket. I am around 80% sure that it will be able to be installed without relocating the PS reservoir on the LNF cars. We should all know around the end of next week.
Thanks,
Dave
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I am sending a prototype to Snaponbob next week, it looks like you may be able to get away without relocating the P/S reservoir on the LNF cars with some slight bending of the bracket. I am around 80% sure that it will be able to be installed without relocating the PS reservoir on the LNF cars.
Awesome! Bob, let us know how it all works out ASAP.
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Awesome! Bob, let us know how it all works out ASAP.
Please send money in denominations no small than 20 to my PayPal account !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)
BTW, I have been sucking up to Dave for almost a YEAR !!!!!!!!! Phew.
As soon as I have it, I will get it fitted and let Dave know what's going on. If Dave okays it, I will post some pics. His call on that.
2nd BTW, thanks Dave. (Ongoing sucking up!!!!) Let me know when the CAI is sorted out on the new dyno. That is on the "to do" list as well.
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I ordered one yesterday. I guess I'll move the PS pump anyway since I already ordered it.
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OK, pulled the trigger. Ordered with the relo kit in the end. Think I want to be able to easily see the PS fluid level - just in case :)
Thanks Dave!
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I have had the DDMWorks Power Steering Relocation kit for almost a year now and have not installed it yet...I will now. Just picked up the GM Power Steering fluid at the dealership. I will see if I have the time to can relocate it tonight.
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I just ordered the DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace from Dave at DDMWorks. We got the Probeam and Race Backbone installed by DDMWorks at the Denver National Meet. I am asking that he install at the Austin NASSM! PM has been sent to Dave and all the great guys and gals at DDMWorks!!!!!!!
DDMWorks, Dave, Mike, and all the great employee's at this great Vendor :urock: :usa: :drive: :yay: :thumbs: :drool:
Oh, Dave, almost forgot, ours must be "Red" to go along with the Victory Red on Miss Red Eagle. Don't want a pink one like "Gentleman Jack"!
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Wow, nothing like scheduling the first install for the Nationals next year
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Oh, Dave, almost forgot, ours must be "Red" to go along with the Victory Red on Miss Red Eagle. Don't want a pink one like "Gentleman Jack"!
:lol: :lol: :thumbs: Ron!
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Wow, nothing like scheduling the first install for the Nationals next year
Actually we already have a couple installs on the books for the nationals next year, really looking forward to it!
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Just a couple, is it that bad Dave, do I need to buy something? :poke:
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Just a couple, is it that bad Dave, do I need to buy something? :poke:
I think you got the drift Critterman! :rofl:
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Dave, we placed our order on 08\23\10, so we should be getting it for the introductory price of $200.00 on the Red Cross Bay Brace. Do you want payment now, pryor to install in order to receive the lower price, or at time of install in Austin, Texas?
Ron
GXPinKC
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Dave, we placed our order on 08\23\10, so we should be getting it for the introductory price of $200.00 on the Red Cross Bay Brace. Do you want payment now, pryor to install in order to receive the lower price, or at time of install in Austin, Texas?
Ron
GXPinKC
GXPinKC,
actually, the intro price for all members of KP was 225. the minimum order was 8 people and the 9th order got thiers free. I was the 9th order, so please be sure to pay the extra 25 bucks so I recieve mine soon. I really appreciate all the first 8 orders. I will be sure to take pics when I do the install.
GJ
just kidding
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GXPinKC,
actually, the intro price for all members of KP was 225. the minimum order was 8 people and the 9th order got thiers free. I was the 9th order, so please be sure to pay the extra 25 bucks so I recieve mine soon. I really appreciate all the first 8 orders. I will be sure to take pics when I do the install.
GJ
just kidding
Actually that was the deal offered for the first 8 pink versions ;)
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Actually that was the deal offered for the first 8 pink versions ;)
Ah, thanks Dave@DDMWorks for the clarification!!! Uh, Gentleman Jack, I do believe that you have been scuttled by the one and only Dave@DDMWorks! The master himself has spoken!!! I do believe that an apology is in order for GXPinKC!
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oops.
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Dave, if you can find powder coat in that hot passion pink, I will pay for the coating on JG's crossbeam.
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Hey why not make them all PINK. Hee Hee
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Any news on an ETA for the first batch?
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Dave, if you can find powder coat in that hot passion pink, I will pay for the coating on JG's crossbeam.
Critterman, what a kind offer to Dave at DDMWorks! I am sure that Gentleman Jack is in your debt! :lol:
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Just ordered my crossbrace yesterday. I can't wait!!!
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NICE!!!
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OK, so apart from being a little derailed on the idea of PINK! - there was still no answer to my enquiry.
Randy, Dave, any idea when the braces will be shipped? You had said end of August originally... just looking for an idea of the latest info. Thanks.
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OK, so apart from being a little derailed on the idea of PINK! - there was still no answer to my enquiry.
Randy, Dave, any idea when the braces will be shipped? You had said end of August originally... just looking for an idea of the latest info. Thanks.
Checked with them yesterday on it and waiting for the phone call back on production status, once I hear something back, I will let everyone know.
Thanks,
Dave
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Just a little update, they are done cutting and off to powdercoat!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rHaCVA6rdw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rHaCVA6rdw)
Thanks!
Dave
-btw-the pictures at the end of installed braces are of the prototypes, just so no one thinks they have been left out.
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Cool video. Saw it on FB. :thumbs:
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Thanks to Dave and all the good guys and gals at DDMWorks!
You always go above and beyond expectations of producing superior products that are outstanding. I look forward to the Austin NASSM and the installation of our DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace!
GXPinKC
Ron
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Ok, they have arrived!
We have roughly 40 of these that we are working on getting packaged up, wrapped and boxed to ship out. Some are out the door today and some are out the door tomorrow!
Looking forward to getting these in everyone's hands!
Dave
(http://ddmworks.com/top_secret_stuff/cbb1.JPG)
(http://ddmworks.com/top_secret_stuff/cbb2.JPG)
(http://ddmworks.com/top_secret_stuff/cbb3.JPG)
Thanks again for your orders, enjoy!
Dave
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Ohhhh boy! I wan'it I wan'it. Gimme, gimme!
Those all look red though, I ordered black. Are only the red ones in?
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The black ones are there also, I think those were getting boxed up first. Almost done with the instructions and working to get to UPS before 8:00pm :drive:
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WOOHOO! Just got my shipping notice! I can't wait! Oh, Dave how's my stage 3 parts coming along?
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The black ones are there also, I think those were getting boxed up first. Almost done with the instructions and working to get to UPS before 8:00pm :drive:
Dave If i make it to your meet in OCT can i get a Black Starlight Installed w /PC relocation kit ? Hope I'll have my car back by then . :banghead: they pinched door somehow now it hits fender But they are still looking for Oil Leak .( On going Saga)
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Got my crossbrace in today! Yay! Gotta finish painting then install this weekend maybe. Nice work, DDM! It looks fantastic!
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Got my crossbrace in today! Yay! Gotta finish painting then install this weekend maybe. Nice work, DDM! It looks fantastic!
Helios, I believe you are the first to receive your Cross Bay Brace from DDMWorks for your 07 Supercharged Saturn Sky, nice that you live in Charleston, SC, not far from Greenville, South Carolina! Oh, my goodness, you lucky dog, sure glad you have received yours, and since you are the first, uh, yes, and extensive update is in order for you to post on this forum about your thoughts. I mean, difficulty of install, time to install, and then after install, your insight after a test drive or two. I am sure it will do everything that Dave and all at DDMWorks say it will do in tightening up the front end.
Uh, pardon the off topic on part of this post, but here goes and I wll receive heat for this but...snaponbob (Bob) has graciously sent me a PM that he would install the DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace if I was to have it shipped. Now, I am already in his debt for installing my T-Bolt Clamps on Miss Red Eagle way back! And I caught heck on that as well, and we just live accross town from each other, and way back we had a dual Dyno at the premier Dyno shop in the Kansas City area.
Ah, to wait til the NASSM in Austin or to pull the trigger sooner? It's like Christmas, remember the night before when you couldn't sleep and listened for hoove's on the roof? It's kinda like that...
Well, this post is getting way to long. Thanks Bob for offering. I am thinking...
Ron
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I should be installing the crossbay brace after work today. The paint has finished drying and I have gathered my tools from work to complete the project. Updates to follow.
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Ron, I would take Bob up on his offer. Bob could do an install like that with his eyes closed and I bet he's got it done in less time than it takes to get the tools out.
Besides, what if there are problems getting a quantity of braces before the Austin NASSM and you can't get one next year for Miss Red Eagle? :poke:
:D
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Well, I received my cross brace for my 08 with a stage 2 supercharger. It took me about an hour and a half to install it this morning. The hardness part was installing the brace tower on the passenger side. There is not much room to get the brace in with the supercharger body. The air intake tube support also uses the shock bolt for mounting, so the tube bracket does get in the way. Had to loosen the hose clamps on both end so I could rotate it out of the way to get the cross tower brace in.
All in all it is a easy install and looks great. Can't way to put it thru a few turns to see how it handles. :thumbs:
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Thanks dwdgraysol for your post and welcome to the Kappa Performace Forum! Please report back after your test drive!
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Well, I received my cross brace for my 08 with a stage 2 supercharger. It took me about an hour and a half to install it this morning. The hardness part was installing the brace tower on the passenger side. There is not much room to get the brace in with the supercharger body. The air intake tube support also uses the shock bolt for mounting, so the tube bracket does get in the way. Had to loosen the hose clamps on both end so I could rotate it out of the way to get the cross tower brace in.
All in all it is a easy install and looks great. Can't way to put it thru a few turns to see how it handles. :thumbs:
Yeap, the install is a little tight with the supercharger in there, let us know what you think after the test drive. On our test car we noticed a difference in turn in response and cowl shake over irregularities, the front end feels a lot tighter on ours now, let us know what you find with yours!
Thanks,
Dave
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Uh, pardon the off topic on part of this post, but here goes and I wll receive heat for this but...snaponbob (Bob) has graciously sent me a PM that he would install the DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace if I was to have it shipped. Now, I am already in his debt for installing my T-Bolt Clamps on Miss Red Eagle way back! And I caught heck on that as well, and we just live accross town from each other, and way back we had a dual Dyno at the premier Dyno shop in the Kansas City area.
Well, this post is getting way to long. Thanks Bob for offering. I am thinking...
Ron
You are absolutely NOT in debt to ME. It was my pleasure. Fortunately, the cross brace is a LOT easier than those clamps. Those were no fun on YOUR car and no fun on MY car. Bring the car over. It will take no time at all.
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Ta know, I forgot all about the cowl shake issue. With springs about triple the stock rate I get plenty of it. As a matter of fact, I have a cracked windshield from the flex as well. But, that said, the cowl shake is all but gone.
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Well, I received my cross brace for my 08 with a stage 2 supercharger. It took me about an hour and a half to install it this morning. The hardness part was installing the brace tower on the passenger side. There is not much room to get the brace in with the supercharger body. The air intake tube support also uses the shock bolt for mounting, so the tube bracket does get in the way. Had to loosen the hose clamps on both end so I could rotate it out of the way to get the cross tower brace in.
All in all it is a easy install and looks great. Can't way to put it thru a few turns to see how it handles. :thumbs:
dwdgraysol
:ttiwwp:
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Ta know, I forgot all about the cowl shake issue. With springs about triple the stock rate I get plenty of it. As a matter of fact, I have a cracked windshield from the flex as well. But, that said, the cowl shake is all but gone.
Now that remark Bob, should seal the deal for any who have yet to pull the trigger on the DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace. Our 2007 GXP has the standard springs so the cowl shake issue is not even a factor. I have driven Bob's 2007 Sky Redline and I was blown away with it. Now, his remark that with the DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace "the cowl shake is all but gone" is a prime example of what you can expect if your purchase the DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace.
What I am saying is, if you have any doubts, whatsoever, just do it! Place your order and the smile will be as large as the one on Jack Nicholson's face in the movie 'Batman"!
Now, as soon as my Red DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace arrives and is installed, I will oblige and ask Bob to drive "Miss Red Eagle" again! :thumbs: :2c:
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Just go for, I let Joe do most of my installs :)
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The hardness part was installing the brace tower on the passenger side. There is not much room to get the brace in with the supercharger body. The air intake tube support also uses the shock bolt for mounting, so the tube bracket does get in the way.
:agree: :agree: :agree: It took me about an hour to get mine installed last night. The passenger side is definitely a tight fit. Not much clearance in a few spots, but it does clear. When you stomp on the gas pedal, the engine doesn't rock and hit the cross brace. I was a bit worried, but it's all good. Handling has improved a bit after the install. More point and go without the sloppiness of loading and unloading through corners.
Pics:
[attachment=1][attachment=2][attachment=3][attachment=4]
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Looking good, Joey! :thumbs:
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:agree: :agree: :agree: It took me about an hour to get mine installed last night. The passenger side is definitely a tight fit. Not much clearance in a few spots, but it does clear. When you stomp on the gas pedal, the engine doesn't rock and hit the cross brace. I was a bit worried, but it's all good. Handling has improved a bit after the install. More point and go without the sloppiness of loading and unloading through corners.
Pics:
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
Good Job Joey!
What did you paint yours with? That is not how we sent it to you ;)
Dave
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Good Job Joey!
What did you paint yours with? That is not how we sent it to you ;)
Dave
Hehehe! You like that? I was really impressed with how my brake calipers turned out when I used the stuff this spring so I had already decided to paint the crossbrace with the same stuff. Dupli-color "Clear effects" paint gives that "starlight" sheen that you guys add to your powdercoating process. I applied 4 to 5 coats to the crossbrace and I think it turned out great! I'm thinking of using it or Shadow to paint the chrome charge tubes when I get Stage 3 from you guys. There are two other Duplicolor products I want to try and see how they work out: Shadow (chrome-blackout) and Nite Lites (a highly reflective coating). Are my stage 3 parts ready yet? ;)
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Joey, can you take a picture that shows the clearance between the bottom of the brace and the S/C?
Thanks,
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Joey, can you take a picture that shows the clearance between the bottom of the brace and the S/C?
Thanks,
Sure. I'll snap some pics after work today.
Forgot to mention that the dimensions for cutting the wheel well liner are larger than they needed to be. I found that the 3" long cut on the rear sections were too long. The channel bulb rubber does not fit tight towards and on the rear section. I'll post a pic of that as well.
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Critter,
Here's the pics you wanted plus the ones about the wheelwell liner cuts being too large towards the rear (I cut according to directions).
[attachment=1][attachment=2][attachment=3][attachment=4][attachment=5][attachment=6][attachment=7]
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Your right when you say that there isn't a lot of room there. I assume that the fillers at the wheelhouse liners as pictured in the last few pics were not supplied by DDM?
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Your right when you say that there isn't a lot of room there. I assume that the fillers at the wheelhouse liners as pictured in the last few pics were not supplied by DDM?
The channel rubber is supplied with the brace from DDM. Included in the crossbay brace kit: 2 x crossbrace towers, 1 x crossbrace beam, approx. 1 ft of channel rubber, and bolts/washers/nuts for brace assy.
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Forgot to mention that the dimensions for cutting the wheel well liner are larger than they needed to be. I found that the 3" long cut on the rear sections were too long. The channel bulb rubber does not fit tight towards and on the rear section. I'll post a pic of that as well.
I looked at your photos, but it only seems maybe 1/4" too long at the most (enough for error clearance). Is that all you meant, or am I missing something?
Don't like the look of the rubber trim strips though. I think I'll use a multitool saw and try and cut mine as neatly as possible and (hopefully) avoid the need for the strips.
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I looked at your photos, but it only seems maybe 1/4" too long at the most (enough for error clearance). Is that all you meant, or am I missing something?
Don't like the look of the rubber trim strips though. I think I'll use a multitool saw and try and cut mine as neatly as possible and (hopefully) avoid the need for the strips.
Yeah, that's all I meant. It's only slightly too long. I'd rather have the channel rubber to seal the gap between the liner and the towers then to let it be open and possibly allow more road grime up into the engine bay.
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Thanks Joey, number 2 is what I was concerned about. With the brace I tested last year after going stage III I was hitting the brace there, hard enough to start cutting into the SC cover.
I don't have any rubber in my cuts, that is new with the new brace, but I have to tell you it doesn't sling that much grim into the engine bay.
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Thanks Joey, number 2 is what I was concerned about. With the brace I tested last year after going stage III I was hitting the brace there, hard enough to start cutting into the SC cover.
I don't have any rubber in my cuts, that is new with the new brace, but I have to tell you it doesn't sling that much grim into the engine bay.
So how'd you resolve the problem? Modified the brace you have? I'd hate to think I can't upgrade to Stage 3 on 10/23 because I installed the brace. Obviously if this becomes a problem for me, the brace will have to go. :devil:
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So how'd you resolve the problem? Modified the brace you have? I'd hate to think I can't upgrade to Stage 3 on 10/23 because I installed the brace. Obviously if this becomes a problem for me, the brace will have to go. :devil:
Joey,
He had one of the early prototype braces, not the same one that you have and that we are shipping now. The new braces fit Stage 1-3 Superchargers :)
Dave
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Joey,
He had one of the early prototype braces, not the same one that you have and that we are shipping now. The new braces fit Stage 1-3 Superchargers :)
Dave
Thanks for the clarification and explanation Dave.
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I installed my brace last night...I like it...my co-works think it looks great....Thanks DDMWorks.
(http://www.kappaperformance.com/gallery/160_06_10_10_3_07_54.jpeg)
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DRM, the DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace looks awesome! Thanks for the picture! Our red one has shipped and will be here friday, can't wait!!!
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So, mine has arrived and is waiting for me at home while I'm sitting here in my hotel room on the other side of the country (San Jose) :(
I haven't seen anything here about the PS resevoir move. Anyone done that and have photos and/or tips? (This is what I'm most worried about for my install.)
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DRM, the DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace looks awesome! Thanks for the picture! Our red one has shipped and will be here friday, can't wait!!!
GXPinKC, Thanks....enjoy installing it...It looks awesome when done. I'm glad I got it. I had a strut brace for my BMW Z3 and was wondering when someone would make something like it for our Solstices.
Just don't do what I did and end up in the Emergency room having your thumb glued back together because your Dremel with the saw blade attachment got away from you when cutting the wheel well liner. lol
I took the advice of Helios and used a box cutter the next night to trim the wheel wells and finish the job.
Also I had a very hard time screwing down the passenger side tower brace. The nut toward the front of the car seemed almost impossible to get to.
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So, mine has arrived and is waiting for me at home while I'm sitting here in my hotel room on the other side of the country (San Jose) :(
I haven't seen anything here about the PS resevoir move. Anyone done that and have photos and/or tips? (This is what I'm most worried about for my install.)
Moving the power steering reservoir is pretty straight forward. It is the same kit we have been using on the superchargers for almost 3 years now. The trickiest part is getting the hoses routed and trimmed to length for your car, and that is not hard, just takes a little time ;)
Hope that helps,
Dave
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So how'd you resolve the problem? Modified the brace you have? I'd hate to think I can't upgrade to Stage 3 on 10/23 because I installed the brace. Obviously if this becomes a problem for me, the brace will have to go. devil
Joey,
He had one of the early prototype braces, not the same one that you have and that we are shipping now. The new braces fit Stage 1-3 Superchargers Smile
Dave
What he said, we took it off and Dave and company went back to the drawing boards. The fix is in Dave's hands. I will probably not get it until the next Mod meet, that way Dave can check the fitment.
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GXPinKC, Thanks....enjoy installing it...It looks awesome when done. I'm glad I got it. I had a strut brace for my BMW Z3 and was wondering when someone would make something like it for our Solstices.
Just don't do what I did and end up in the Emergency room having your thumb glued back together because your Dremel with the saw blade attachment got away from you when cutting the wheel well liner. lol
I took the advice of Helios and used a box cutter the next night to trim the wheel wells and finish the job.
Also I had a very hard time screwing down the passenger side tower brace. The nut toward the front of the car seemed almost impossible to get to.
No job is complete without a little blood spill, but you don't need to take it to extremes.
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LOL...my wife was kind enough to clean the blood out of my engine bay without me even asking....What a woman...
Sorry if this is off subject...
(http://www.kappaperformance.com/gallery/160_06_10_10_1_21_45.jpeg)
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Nice, at least you missed the nail.
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Owww!!!!
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Nice, at least you missed the nail.
Exactly.....
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LOL...my wife was kind enough to clean the blood out of my engine bay without me even asking....What a woman...
Sorry if this is off subject...
(http://www.kappaperformance.com/gallery/160_06_10_10_1_21_45.jpeg)
Wow DRM, you are indeed a very lucky man! After I saw your posted picture of your sliced and blood soaked finger, got to feeling kind of queasy. You are indeed lucky to have a mate so caring and just jumps in and takes care of the problem. Life is good!!! You and your lovely wife just rejoice in life and don't look back, because you guy's have owned two great vehicles, your 2007 Deep Pontiac Solstice GXP and that BMW Z3. How sweet does life get!!! :yay: :drive: :thumbs: :2c:
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Ron, let me know when your stuff arrives. I am ready for a blood free install.
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what dont kill you only makes you stronger DRM :-) well if that statement were true i would be a super hero
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Jeez DRM don't you ever clean under your finger nails?
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Jeez DRM don't you ever clean under your finger nails?
Alright you got me...Thats what I was really trying to do....lol
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:lol:
Thanks for sharing, Derek!
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Ron, let me know when your stuff arrives. I am ready for a blood free install.
Bob, the DDMWorks Red Cross Bay Brace arrived UPS Ground twenty minutes ago! :yay: :thumbs: :drool: :usa:
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Bob, the DDMWorks Red Cross Bay Brace arrived UPS Ground twenty minutes ago! :yay: :thumbs: :drool: :usa:
So yours is already red, perfect for spilling blood!
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Bob, the DDMWorks Red Cross Bay Brace arrived UPS Ground twenty minutes ago! :yay: :thumbs: :drool: :usa:
Contact me earlier next week. We'll "get-r-done".
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So, just to add a quick review of the installed brace...
I put mine in on Saturday morning. Worst parts of the install were removing the PS fluid hose and draining without trying to get fluid all over the chassis (I failed). Then routing the longer hoses while keeping them away from the turbo was a struggle. As for the brace itself, cutting the liners was the worst part, closely followed by trying to tighten the front passenger side tower nut. TIP: to save you time, the only way to tighten that nut is to use an open-ended wrench from inside the wheel liner (over the tire). Other tower nuts work with a socket+extension.
OK, onto driving. I did a fair bit of street driving to try it out. I did feel a bit more directness in the steering - though I have to admit I'm not sure if that's "emperor's new clothes" syndrome or not. One thing that was obvious though was the reduction in cowl shake. Now the Kappa is pretty stiff for a 'vert and it takes a decent pothole to set up a quiver, but this brace makes it noticeably better. More solid feeling, less rattle. Recommended if only for that!
EDIT: One other thing I forgot to mention, there seems to be a tad more oversteer - certainly on sharp turns - with the brace in place. Nothing startling, mind, but interesting.
Thanks DDM!
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TS, thanks for taking time to post pictures with your write up :kwh:
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TS, thanks for taking time to post pictures with your write up :kwh:
ppppppthpthpt! :p
:)
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I'm installing my new shocks and springs soon, should I put this off until then?
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I'm installing my new shocks and springs soon, should I put this off until then?
The two are largely independent - with the exception of removing/replacing the four top tower nuts. It might save a little time to do them together. You could still prepare the wheel liner cutting in advance.
If you are going to move the PS reservoir (and haven't already) then you should do that in advance too.
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Cool thanks. I got the relocation kit to so I'll do that first, not looking forward to it after your description of the process though !
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Hey if you let Dave and Randy do it, they don't spill a drop.
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I'm too cheap to have them install it just to stop from making a mess on my driveway :)
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Shocks and springs will be a lot easier without the brace.
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I'm too cheap to have them install it just to stop from making a mess on my driveway :)
just make sure to have the car up on jack stands and put something underneath to catch the fluid and you should be good. That is how we do it and nothing gets on the ground :)
Hope that helps,
Dave
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just make sure to have the car up on jack stands and put something underneath to catch the fluid and you should be good. That is how we do it and nothing gets on the ground :)
Yeah, that's how I did it. Nothing got on the ground, but I did get it over the chassis. Sigh.
Anyway, given DBG's dig, I took a couple of photos of my PS reservoir tube routing (there's plenty of photos of the brace install already!). This is definitely not the only way to route these, maybe not even the best way, but it's what I did, if it helps...
First, showing the new mounting bracket in place sandwiched between the fusebox bracket and the body bracket, using the original bolt and clip nut that was there. I routed the tubes between the two arms of the fender bracket and then nice and snug between the inner arm and the wheelwell liner (arrow):
[attachment=1]
Next is taken from the inner (engine) side of the fusebox, showing the tubes, arrowed, coming out from the wheelwell area as noted above:
[attachment=2]
Lastly one taken from above showing the two tubes (smaller below and obscured by the larger) zip-tied back to the old reservoir bracket, away from the turbo (A). Then the smaller tube is zip-tied to the shock tower (B) but protected from wear by a small cutoff of the smaller tube that's been slit down its length and pushed over the metal lip:
[attachment=3]
Tip: route the tubes first and make sure all is good, before attaching either end(s) (Don't ask)
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Yeah, that's how I did it. Nothing got on the ground, but I did get it over the chassis. Sigh.
Anyway, given DBG's dig, I took a couple of photos of my PS reservoir tube routing (there's plenty of photos of the brace install already!). This is definitely not the only way to route these, maybe not even the best way, but it's what I did, if it helps...
First, showing the new mounting bracket in place sandwiched between the fusebox bracket and the body bracket, using the original bolt and clip nut that was there. I routed the tubes between the two arms of the fender bracket and then nice and snug between the inner arm and the wheelwell liner (arrow):
(Attachment Link)
Next is taken from the inner (engine) side of the fusebox, showing the tubes, arrowed, coming out from the wheelwell area as noted above:
(Attachment Link)
Lastly one taken from above showing the two tubes (smaller below and obscured by the larger) zip-tied back to the old reservoir bracket, away from the turbo (A). Then the smaller tube is zip-tied to the shock tower (B) but protected from wear by a small cutoff of the smaller tube that's been slit down its length and pushed over the metal lip:
(Attachment Link)
Tip: route the tubes first and make sure all is good, before attaching either end(s) (Don't ask)
Good little write up.
As an extra little help, when installing the kit, I always route the hoses back to where they are going to go, then install them onto the reservoir. At that point you can see how much you need to trim. I then mark the hose, remove the reservoir and trim the hose and re-install. Takes a couple extra minutes to do, but allows a really good fit on the hose length to make sure there is no kinking.
Hope that helps,
Dave
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As an extra little help, when installing the kit, I always route the hoses back to where they are going to go, then install them onto the reservoir. At that point you can see how much you need to trim. I then mark the hose, remove the reservoir and trim the hose and re-install. Takes a couple extra minutes to do, but allows a really good fit on the hose length to make sure there is no kinking.
You bring up a good point there... The instructions don't say anything about trimming the hoses to length.
I found that (at least the way I routed it) the bigger hose was just about perfect length and so I assumed you'd already cut them to correct length. The smaller hose however was too long and I was a little worried I'd done something wrong :) I ended up cutting 4-5 inches off - and could probably have taken a little more - but with the zip-ties, is wasn't banging around so I left it at that.
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You bring up a good point there... The instructions don't say anything about trimming the hoses to length.
I found that (at least the way I routed it) the bigger hose was just about perfect length and so I assumed you'd already cut them to correct length. The smaller hose however was too long and I was a little worried I'd done something wrong :) I ended up cutting 4-5 inches off - and could probably have taken a little more - but with the zip-ties, is wasn't banging around so I left it at that.
I will put it in the instructions that it is ok to cut the hose, always good to get feedback like that :)
Dave
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measure twice - cut once
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Thanks TS
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I'm installing my new shocks and springs soon, should I put this off until then?
Kenny you should still be Honey-Mooning Not working on the Damn Car :banghead: :gaah:
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We were there for a week. Back to work today.
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One thing that was obvious though was the reduction in cowl shake.
One thing that's been a bit annoying with my Stage 2 was the RPMs would drop low sometimes as if the car would stall. The car would shudder in response, but the RPMs would normally return to normal. The cross bay brace had reduced the shudder SIGNIFICANTLY. I still don't know why the RPMs behave this way. Hopefully, it will get better with my move to stage 3.
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I'm sure it's not supposed to do that, I would contact DDM about it.
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I'm sure it's not supposed to do that, I would contact DDM about it.
They have looked at it on a few occasions. Nothing has ever been found. They tweeked the tune and it was better for a little while, but returned to the same condition a few months later.
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Another way of avoiding spilling PS fluid either on the chassis or the ground is to siphon the PS fluid out of the reservoir first and then disconnect the hoses. A lot less fluid drains out and can be easily absorbed by a rag just underneath the hose connections. I moved the PS resrevior over the battery this past weekend to get ready to install the brace. No mess, no spill. Planning to install the brace later this week. Thanks for posting your suggestions on the brace install.
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Contact me earlier next week. We'll "get-r-done".
So yours is already red, perfect for spilling blood!
Thanks Bob for taking the time to install the Red Cross Bay Brace from DDMWorks today as well as the Solstice / Sky Power Steering Relocation Kit a few hours ago! Great job and it was fun again getting together and discussing thngs Kappa.
Sorry, that you had to spill a drop of Red Blood on you thumb. Anyway, it was great fun for Carol and I to get to see you again and visit. Extreme Kudo's my friend!!!!!! Very Sweet Indeed does the Red DDMWorks Cross Bay Brace look under the hood, and we could feel the difference as we traveled back to Olathe, Kansas. :yay: :thumbs: :drive: :urock: :2c:
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Sorry, that you had to spill a drop of Red Blood on you thumb.
:ttiwwp:
Sorry Bob, just had to give you a hard time. :cheers:
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:ttiwwp:
Sorry Bob, just had to give you a hard time. :cheers:
Actually, skinned my knuckle above the fourth finger a tiny bit. If Ron had not told me, I probably would have missed it entirely. Only one tiny hiccup with the install of reservoir as the instructions called out a threaded insert of a 6mm bolt, but a flanged nut from my junk drawer took care of that. All went smoothly, and only needed 1.5 pints to top off the system. Fun install.
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Just sucks that we can't do it and stay B-SP legal. :mad:
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Actually, skinned my knuckle above the fourth finger a tiny bit. If Ron had not told me, I probably would have missed it entirely. Only one tiny hiccup with the install of reservoir as the instructions called out a threaded insert of a 6mm bolt, but a flanged nut from my junk drawer took care of that. All went smoothly, and only needed 1.5 pints to top off the system. Fun install.
Was that 1.5 pints of blood or power steering fluid? :lol:
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I was thinking 1.5 pints of beer? ;)
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Just sucks that we can't do it and stay B-SP legal. :mad:
Do what?
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Do what?
Use the power steering relocation kit.
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Use the power steering relocation kit.
Thought so. FWIW, I have a brace installed and left the reservoir in the stock location. It IS a bit of a pain to do, but it CAN be done. The down sides are no access to the cap unless the cross piece is removed, and adjusting the right front shock is a headache. Given the "issues", the brace is STILL worth the limitations. If the P.S. is not leaking, I don't need to check the fluid very often, and I fashioned a tool for the adjuster. Since I have found the shock settings I want, the only time I need to play with the shocks is for concrete or asphalt.
So, there ya go. It CAN be done.
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I was thinking 1.5 pints of beer? ;)
That's what I was thinking! :thumbs: :lol:
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That's what I was thinking! :thumbs: :lol:
F the beer. A double martini --- AFTER the work is done !!!!!!!!!!!!! A martini causes sockets and wrenches to not fit correctly.
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F the beer. A double martini --- AFTER the work is done !!!!!!!!!!!!! A martini causes sockets and wrenches to not fit correctly.
Oooooo....you have class! I like that! ;)